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Slow hydraulics on JD 4430
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/11/2009 20:13 (#741679)
Subject: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
  My neighbor has a 4430 that he is having problems with the hydraulics working slowly. This tractor has the syncrorange transmission. A couple of weeks ago he had trouble with the steering one mourning not working right and had unhooked from the inplement he was using to change tractors. After unhooking and when he was moving the tractor out of the way the steering started working again so he hooked back up to implement and used for several more days without any problems. He is now having trouble with the hydraulics not wanting to raise the cylinder on his 6 row do-all. It is very slow and will not raise the do-all completely. The main pump on the front of the tractor is leaking some but I have seen them leak a lot worse and still work. I had him change the hydraulic filter and clean the screen in the trans case and this helped very little if at all. Any suggestions as to where one needs to start? Is the 30 and 40 series basically the same . I have 40 series shop book I could study up on some.
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Fla Veggie Farmer
Posted 6/11/2009 20:17 (#741688 - in reply to #741679)
Subject: RE: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


Southeast Florida
First thing is what is the pressure at the SCV's?
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/11/2009 20:38 (#741726 - in reply to #741688)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
<p>I haven't checked that but am thinking that the cylinder working very slowly is telling me that it is low. I did think that maybe we ought to try hooking to another cylinder to see if maybe the one we were using has a internal leak.</p><p>  I checked with him and he did unhook and hook another tractor to the cylinder and it worked fine</p>

Edited by AR Plowboy 6/11/2009 21:06
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Fla Veggie Farmer
Posted 6/11/2009 21:22 (#741794 - in reply to #741726)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


Southeast Florida
It sound like the front pump took a dump.
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Hawken Cougar
Posted 6/11/2009 21:28 (#741800 - in reply to #741679)
Subject: RE: Replace the transmission pump first. n/t



So. IL
.
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/11/2009 21:43 (#741817 - in reply to #741800)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
I was thinking that the pump in the trans could be giving trouble. I have to get my book out and do some studying.
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Fla Veggie Farmer
Posted 6/11/2009 21:57 (#741842 - in reply to #741817)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


Southeast Florida
Check the charge pressure to the front pump and that will tell you a whole lot about the transmission pump
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Hawken Cougar
Posted 6/11/2009 22:13 (#741878 - in reply to #741842)
Subject: Re: What's there to know about a transmission pump?



So. IL

It's either good or it's bad.

Besides, if they knew what they were doing they would have already checked the charge pressure.

This is a shade tree mechanic operation. They don't even have the correct technical manual yet.


How much you want to bet they will be changing the transmission pump?  Money mouth







Edited by Hawken Cougar 6/11/2009 22:24
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Fla Veggie Farmer
Posted 6/11/2009 22:26 (#741906 - in reply to #741878)
Subject: Re: What's there to know about a transmission pump?


Southeast Florida
I'm not going to take that bet because its what I really think the problem is too. That's the way we always checked the old closed center tractors was read the pressure with engine running 1200-1500 rpm's and no functions, if it reads close to 2250 psi work the steering wheel back and forth a couple of time and if the pressure drops out you've got a clogged sump screen or bad charge pump.

Speaking of sump screen has anybody pulled the screen out yet to see what else comes out? There's a real easy way to check it without dumping the oil. Tape the shop vacuum hose to the filler neck on suction before you pull the plug.

Edited by Fla Veggie Farmer 6/11/2009 22:29
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Hawken Cougar
Posted 6/11/2009 22:35 (#741916 - in reply to #741906)
Subject: Re: Dagnabbit



So. IL

Fla Veggie Farmer - 6/11/2009 21:26

I'm not going to take that bet because its what I really think the problem is too. That's the way we always checked the old closed center tractors was read the pressure with engine running 1200-1500 rpm's and no functions, if it reads close to 2250 psi work the steering wheel back and forth a couple of time and if the pressure drops out you've got a clogged sump screen or bad charge pump.

Speaking of sump screen has anybody pulled the screen out yet to see what else comes out? There's a real easy way to check it without dumping the oil. Tape the shop vacuum hose to the filler neck on suction before you pull the plug.

 

That's a pretty durn smart idea!

 

 

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tileplow
Posted 6/11/2009 22:49 (#741938 - in reply to #741679)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


N Central IA
The first thing I would do is destroke the pump with a destroking screw. The stroke control vale can sometimes get metal in them and cause them to work erratically. If the pump didn't work and is now working off and on I would say this is a good possibility. The major break down theories are probably not on the right path, these pumps don't have a major breakdown then fix themselves, jmo. Good luck
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/11/2009 23:03 (#741969 - in reply to #741938)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
Thanks Tileplow. I don't know what I did to H C to get him on my case I just asked a question. I thought about the destroking screw trick but this tractor didn't have one installed.
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Hawken Cougar
Posted 6/11/2009 23:22 (#742012 - in reply to #741969)
Subject: Re: Dear Mr. AR Plowboy



So. IL

I apologize. You did nothing to me and I truly meant nothing toward you.

Right now I am stuck in the middle of the monsoon season. Half of the corn I've planted has been underwater and the other half plastered in. And I'm still waiting and wanting to plant the other half. Did you catch that? Three half's?  Surprised

Regarding the shadetree mechanic comment. In the past, I have been guilty of that more than most. However, with the rising cost of parts and dealer service one cannot afford to continue to be a shadetree mechanic when it comes to repairing one's own equipment. Therefore good technical manuals are a must. There is one other thing that many times is of greater help than the right technical manual and that's the good people on this site who are willing to share information and experience.

Regarding the synchro-range 4430 with the hydrualic problem. We've got a 4430 with the very same symptoms and problem right now. Just trying to hang on till we can finish corn planting and then we will change the transmission pump.

 



 

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msb
Posted 6/11/2009 23:35 (#742041 - in reply to #741679)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


Lapel, In
Cut the filter open and look for black bits of brake lining. If you find some, you have a mess on your hands. Could be every hydraulic component will need going through. I assume the filter has been changed and suction screen has been pulled out and checked for debris. Find any brake lining in the screen ?
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/12/2009 08:38 (#742336 - in reply to #742041)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
We did find a small amount of metal flakes in the screen but the screen was not near stopped up with anything. I cut the filter open and it looked good. Owner did say that he didn't think that he had ever checked the screen on this tractor befour. Several years back the local JD dealership did some transmission work on this tractor and made some mess ups that required them to go back in it twice. It seems like maybe they copied the serial number of the tractor down wrong when ordering parts and then installed the wrong parts.
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Bubbaspb
Posted 6/12/2009 10:09 (#742466 - in reply to #741679)
Subject: RE: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430


Western WI
How hard is it to change the charge pump and where/how do you check the pressure? Dont think ive done one on this new of a tractor lol. Been thru a 4320 and 3020. Isnt there also a hex shaft that pulls out the back that can get worn? thanks
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KelB
Posted 6/12/2009 15:43 (#742774 - in reply to #741938)
Subject: Tile Plow is on track



Ayr Queensland Australia 4807
What it maybe is the stroke control valve has a very small piece of metal causing the pump to destroke , You can pull it out and clean it and reinstall it bit of a bugger to do as you have to keep it clean ,put a bit of grease on the valve spool sit it on a small clean pin punch then put in the guide ,spring and washer in
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AR Plowboy
Posted 6/12/2009 22:57 (#743191 - in reply to #742774)
Subject: Re: Slow hydraulics on JD 4430



East Central Arkansas
I actually messed around today and created the same problem on a 4430 that I have on the farm that sees very little use. Being that the tractor we were working on did not have the destroking screw in the pump I looked around my shop and found an old pump we had changed on a 4020 and it had the destroking screw. The tractor we were working on is several miles away so I removed it and installed it in our tractor to see if it was the right one. It fit and it destroked the pump but when I backed the screw out I have very little hydraulics. You can hear the pump kick in when you back the screw out but you don't have good hydraulics. At least I am not trying to plant a crop with this tractor that I messed up today.
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