Massey1155 - 2/5/2021 15:19 Good tractors, but do your homework Buy from someone that knows what they are selling. Check it for electrical gremlins and updates. (cab susp, finger tips, valve module) 3409 updates ( nice but not completely necessary) I have had both '12 without updates and '14 with all updates. Some run fine without and others don't. Sometimes the A/C won't keep up without updates. But i haven't had a problem with either. I've found quite a few that were not charged correctly (overcharge) and that was causing more problems than anything. Keep the front coolers clean (not just air blown, but power wash them good) and you won't have any problems. Also keep them clean under the cab. Engine and CVT are outstanding Front susp has been excellent Cab is good, cab susp either works good or is crap (but you can replace with spring ride) I prefer the finger tips over joystick (joystick is standard in massey for 1 and 2. All finger tips in challenger DEF has been a non issue for me for '12 and later. If the DEF hoses have been updated, usually not much problems with them. It has been discussed on here repeatedly, just do a search and alot of stuff will come up on them. All in all, good tractors that can be bought reasonable. I think they fair better if not set out all the time. With any modern tractor with electronics, clean and dry helps alot.