It seems that they were the source of much consternation (at least the 2009/10 models).  We currently have 2 12 row Kinze 3600s decked out with Precision Monsanto everything.  So if the problems with the 3800s in the past were mostly with seed monitoring and planter control that shouldn't be an issue.  And if it is it's between me and Precision Monsanto to figure it out.  Are they alright mechanically as long as you can get them to fold and unfold?  Are there any good ways to run 2x2 fert with this bar?  If it has fertilizer coulters, martin row cleaners and is running in no-till in rolling ground will an 8330 or 8430 pull it?