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Grain bin concrete
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Nodak63
Posted 6/14/2017 21:50 (#6071725)
Subject: Grain bin concrete


NE ND		Concrete guys let me know if I'm on the right track. Planning on moving two 21 ft diameter bins that are 7000 bushel and need to pour concrete. Trying to do most everything myself to make it cost feasible. Does 1 foot by 1 foot footer around the perimeter with 6 inch across the center sound sufficient? Would do 2 rows of rebar in footer and 1 foot by 1 foot squares in the middle. Couple other questions, everyone says 2 rows of rebar in footer and that's what I'll do, but does that mean one on top of the other or side by side? I plan on using 3 inch chairs in the middle so should I use 6 inch chairs in the footer and have em side by side? Any advice/opinions would be appreciated. First concrete project, trying to do it right and will probably have someone with experience there to help so we can do more of our own in the future.
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m3farmer
Posted 6/14/2017 22:07 (#6071773 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete



SW Minnesota, Lyon County		I will just reply on the footer, but I would go more than that, like at least double. I'm not sure what you are doing for unload, ie air floor and tube on top of concrete or tube in floor or what, but the higher in the air you get the bin base, the better. Six inches in the center for that size bin should be sufficient in my opinion. I just poored a floor for a 21 foot that I moved basically across the yard. They went down with a trencher 18 inches and the concrete sticks above the ground better than 24 inches. Wouldn't want it any less with the unload tube coming out at concrete level.
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Nodak63
Posted 6/14/2017 22:13 (#6071785 - in reply to #6071773)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


NE ND		I was planning on putting the unload tube in the concrete, I get what you mean with having it higher in the air. So if I go 1 1/2 or 2 foot footer what have others used for forms? I was gonna use hardwood lap siding cause I've heard that works well but it only comes in 12 inch pieces. Not sure how putting two high would work?
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m3farmer
Posted 6/14/2017 22:23 (#6071803 - in reply to #6071785)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete



SW Minnesota, Lyon County		If doing yourself, I would recommend getting some forms from a builder to use. Most of it is simple stuff, like sheet steel with pipe welded to it so rods can be stuck through that and into the ground to hold it in place. The sheet steel can be formed to whatever size you might need. I'd guess you are figuring on an incline auger for unload or something there abouts if you are planning on the unload in the concrete? Go at least 8 inches for auger diameter in the concrete or you will be cussing yourself in the future. I'm sure others will respond with good ideas.
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mpiggy
Posted 6/15/2017 19:45 (#6073140 - in reply to #6071803)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Cen il		I have poured sevaral bins that size and larger and 4 in in the center is plenty and 8 in footer is good
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PeteMN
Posted 6/15/2017 00:48 (#6071930 - in reply to #6071785)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


E.Central MN		We put up a Behlen bin with the unload auger in the concrete. We didn't raise the bin floor high enough so we have to dig a hole under it to unload into an auger, that sucks when it rains, darn near impossible when the ground is froze. I would put an unloading auger in above the cement after its set up, but then you have the additional cost/labor to put in a drying floor(might not be worth it for a small bin). The floor will likely crack where the auger is placed in the cement because you are essentially leaving a gap in the cement.
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John In Ontario
Posted 6/15/2017 04:24 (#6071963 - in reply to #6071930)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete



Ripley, Ontario Canada		I have moved several 19 foot bins. You are not planning enough concrete. I pour a doughnut 18 inches deep and about 5 feet wide around the outside, then slope that up to 6 inches in the middle. If you are doing yourself, make the middle 1 inch higher at least to make sure the water all runs off the slab, it is hard to get it perfect. The last bin I moved, I started going to 24 inches of slab under where the unload comes out. You want 24 inches of clearance under your unload auger, just plan on it, it makes life so much easier and you soon forget about any extra cost, vrs being reminded every time you cant get the auger under to unload.

I got forms made, simple sheet steel 18 inches wide and 10 feet long with interconnecting pipe welded on the ends, drive pins through pipes to hold together, not that complicated. I am going to replace one sheet with a 24 inch wide one for the unload auger though.

Also plan on a 10 inch unload, you are building in 2017, not 1970, things move faster now, and you should build to keep up.
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Farms With CASE
Posted 6/14/2017 22:18 (#6071793 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete



North Liberty and South Bend, Indiana		The best forms I've found are old bin sheets. Bolt together and rounded already. Plus they are nice and tall so you can drop a foot or two below grade and still have a foot or two above grade.
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KRMN FARMN
Posted 6/14/2017 22:25 (#6071807 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Central nebr		Make the footer 3' deep by 6-8" wide. Keeps the rats etc from undermining it. Put 2 rows in footer. 1-6" from top n 1 6" from bottom. Pound a 4' piece every 3-4' vertically in the trench n wire tie the top and bottom rows to that. 3/3 spacing is enough for a small bin like that. Also all you need is 4"depth in the rest of the floor. We also usually put a 90 degree 6"-1'
bend on the rebar in the floor n that hooks over the top course and hangs down into the footer. Also!!! Raise the height of the floor a foot above ground level at least preferably 18". No fun digging a hole for the auger in frozen ground etc
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4WD
Posted 6/14/2017 22:32 (#6071818 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Between Omaha and Des Moines, 7 miles South of I80

I think you should consider a outer trench, for rodent control, just as m3farmer mentioned on his bin foundation.

 

My brother built bin foundations and did bin repairs, for 8 years and they all got outer trenches, on outer perimeters using a Ditch Witch trencher ( I think it went 28" deep). [Later, he went to strictly building new bins.]

 He always said: Once you have to lift a bin and bust out the older flat concrete slabs, that were too weak and cracked/buckled and had varmints tunneling underneath, you will talk the farmers into using "rodent control" for their next slab. {Busting out concrete is a miserable job, I assume}

On the trencher, he had big center stake, with a pivot ring, then a chain assembly that hooked onto the trencher in two locations, so it pulled evenly around in a circle.

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wannabe2
Posted 6/14/2017 22:33 (#6071820 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


NW Montana

Larger footing with 2 rows of #4 rebar side by side. You need to be on undisturbed clay with the footing 18" wide. The rebar in the field can be on 18" centers. Closer wont make it much if any stronger. Yes 6" or 8" chairs for the footing.

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SBAL
Posted 6/15/2017 05:57 (#6072005 - in reply to #6071820)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


I would not put unload auger in concrete. I had 3 like that and have had to replace 2 of the foundations .
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red1962
Posted 6/15/2017 06:32 (#6072046 - in reply to #6072005)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


west central indiana		agree with that concrete will sweat and cause spoilage put in air floor and keep unload tube up high
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Offroadnt
Posted 6/15/2017 07:10 (#6072124 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Southern Alberta Canada		If you're going through that much trouble and expense maybe consider putting them on hoppers? Just think using gravity to do the shoveling and sweeping the rest of your career :-)
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Nodak63
Posted 6/15/2017 07:12 (#6072128 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


NE ND		On the topic of unload augers, I get everyone says you should go bigger cause bigger faster etc. anyone ever point the unloads towards each other so they unload at the same spot? Could unload both bins st once then? Obviously only works if they're both filled with the same crop at the same time.....
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braidy
Posted 6/15/2017 07:40 (#6072182 - in reply to #6072128)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


NW Minnesota

Nodak63 - 6/15/2017 06:12 On the topic of unload augers, I get everyone says you should go bigger cause bigger faster etc. anyone ever point the unloads towards each other so they unload at the same spot? Could unload both bins st once then? Obviously only works if they're both filled with the same crop at the same time.....



If you had trouble with one or the other how would you ever get the unload auger out of the tube?

Pour the foundation higher than you think you need it and do not put the auger in the concrete.

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hillfarmer
Posted 6/15/2017 11:22 (#6072490 - in reply to #6072182)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete



if the augers are extended out a ways from the sidewall

they will dump in the same hopper and still be able to get pulled

i have a auger goes , 120% of the bin

make it nice I have 3 hoppers, slide drawls in it
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4WD
Posted 6/15/2017 11:37 (#6072501 - in reply to #6072128)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Between Omaha and Des Moines, 7 miles South of I80

.





(bin auger possibilites.jpg)



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Attachments bin auger possibilites.jpg (26KB - 48 downloads)
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Shortone
Posted 6/15/2017 07:43 (#6072184 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Sw mn		Just did one. Footer is 2' tall an 16" wide then slope up to a 6 " floor.



(IMG_20170524_102011704.jpg)



(IMG_20170524_102019072_HDR.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments IMG_20170524_102011704.jpg (584KB - 58 downloads)
Attachments IMG_20170524_102019072_HDR.jpg (169KB - 55 downloads)
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Nodak63
Posted 6/15/2017 12:21 (#6072546 - in reply to #6072184)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


NE ND		What are those forms made out of?

Shortone - 6/15/2017 07:43

Just did one. Footer is 2' tall an 16" wide then slope up to a 6 " floor.
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Shortone
Posted 6/15/2017 13:52 (#6072691 - in reply to #6072546)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Sw mn		Barowed them from the local coop. They are 1/8 to 3/16" steel 24" tall 8 foot long. With angle iron welded on the ends to bolt them together. And there are box tube welded every 24" for the stakes with a jam nut on them for setting height.
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Blusteryknollfarm
Posted 6/16/2017 00:21 (#6073607 - in reply to #6072184)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


North Central Illinois		What did you use to pack the fill under the concrete?
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Shortone
Posted 6/19/2017 12:59 (#6078996 - in reply to #6073607)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Sw mn		Wacker packer
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AGDEAL
Posted 6/15/2017 12:26 (#6072551 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Illinois		Marking thread
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Offroadnt
Posted 6/16/2017 08:02 (#6073861 - in reply to #6071725)
Subject: RE: Grain bin concrete


Southern Alberta Canada		Crap! Just discovered our four six year old 22,000bu bins on concrete all have water running under the aerated floors, just emptied one that's had wheat in it for four years and the floor is rotted out, concrete appears to be sloped toward the middle and edge is not sealed properly.

Bin dealer and builders are looking at them and have possibly offered repair options under warranty.

After selling and building hundreds of bins I thought they knew what they were doing...
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