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olf20

Posted 4/26/2017 17:54 (#5983822)
Subject: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

I posted this here as opposed to the Precision form.

Thought more guys would see it.

This is a followup to the posts below:

https://talk.newagtalk.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=656356&posts=10#M5529692

https://talk.newagtalk.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=653868&posts=9#M5508670

There has been many hours of testing done by Digi Farm. Precision has participated in

this but only from a digesting information stand point.

Let me say up front that Precision's view point is "This affects such a few number of

customers, we don't want to fix something for some and mess up something for many."

From what little I know, it affects more than just a few.

If you remember we are using a FMX1000 with a 20/20 with Vdrive.

Our problem is when planting the planter would stop for a second or less and cause a

three foot skip in our fields. Very random, no pattern.

David Dusanek of Digi Farm had been planting with a setup just like ours, except his

FMX had the earlier chip set, which only allowed 12 satellites. Our setup had the newer

chip set which allowed us to have up to 14 or 15 satellites. Dave did not have any skips

with his FMX system.

David had wanted to upgrade his FMX to the TMX for steering (able to make turns at the

headland).

As he started planting he instantly had the 1 second or less skip. This continued thru out

the field(s) very random. Dave then shut down the Digi Farm signal and started using IA Cors.

He continued planting and the skips continued.

It appears the problem lies in the Trimble chip set in the newer FMX's and the TMX's.

We will be switching to a older FMX to see if our problem goes away.

There is a whole lot of technical information that shows the problem, but until last week

there was no ability to repeat the problem with any certainty.

Both Trimble and Precision CAN FIX THE PROBLEM, but not by changing the signal.

No one seems to be interested in solving problems, just finger pointing.

For the money we have put towards these companies we should get better service!!!

I know several of you have emailed me with questions and idea's. I hope this helps some of

you.

One other bit of information that has come to light during all the testing is that the FMX 1000

port A and B do not seem to output the same data that ports C and D do. I'm not smart enought

to define this but I know some people who are.

These are my opinions from personal experience.

olf20 / Bob

Fingers77

Posted 4/26/2017 18:07 (#5983842 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Are you planting VR using perscriptions?

olf20

Posted 4/26/2017 19:17 (#5983965 - in reply to #5983842)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

No we are not. Are you? If so how is it going?
olf20 / Bob

Fingers77

Posted 4/26/2017 19:31 (#5984001 - in reply to #5983965)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Going good.

New to us planter is behaving itself. Now that I think I figured out how it works.

All the far away farms are done, just need it to dry up again and get the emissions on the &@$?%# planter tractor fixed so it doesn't derate.

Then I can finish the near ones.

I had a weird problem with perscriptions causing the planter to stop as you described. Hoping maybe that's your problem.

Fingers77

Posted 4/26/2017 19:40 (#5984026 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

That's not skips on your map.

It's coverage segments based on speed changes in the areas based on your layer choice. I think it has to do with data point size choice too.

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 06:00 (#5984764 - in reply to #5984026)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

Yes, those are like the ones we were seeing.
I will get a picture of one of our fields from
last year and post.
olf20 / Bob

caseihfarmer

Posted 4/26/2017 19:46 (#5984039 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

East Central, Nebraska

so to clarify, digifarm has really nothing to do with this other than they are helping to fix a problem that really has nothing to do with them?

sounds like regardless of rtk source it is having the same outcome using that newer trimble display and the precision planting product?

good thing my old 750 only gets 7 sats.

caseihfarmer

Posted 4/26/2017 19:55 (#5984068 - in reply to #5984039)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

East Central, Nebraska

i would guess where you switched to waas is where there are gaps and not straight lines, otherwise that makes no sense. map looks as if you passed out on the steering wheel.

how are you running a beacon and field view but your ipad shows as if you have no sim card in the ipad.

my point was that this is happening with other rtk correction sources. if you switched to waas and it worked better that maybe helps troubleshoot the issue a little. point was the heading of the post reads that these three companies are having problems with this service though other troubleshooting confirms it is happening using multiple rtk sources.

Edited by caseihfarmer 4/26/2017 20:33

gostate

Posted 4/26/2017 22:30 (#5984509 - in reply to #5984039)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

western iowa

midwest - 4/26/2017 19:50

I wouldn't say that. You can see to the round where I switched to waas signal.

Is it a speed input problem? GPS vs radar? Will the PP map give you a speed where the skips were? I'm just spit balling.

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 06:09 (#5984776 - in reply to #5984509)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

gostate - 4/26/2017 21:30

midwest - 4/26/2017 19:50

I wouldn't say that. You can see to the round where I switched to waas signal.

Is it a speed input problem? GPS vs radar? Will the PP map give you a speed where the skips were? I'm just spit balling.

From the data that Precision digested they said that the speed was somehow going to 0 for a split second
then returning to normal. After looking further into the data it showed that the tractor was actually backing
up for a split second. A lot more technical than I can explain.
One of the solutions offered was to put a globe on the planter and let the 20/20 get its signal from the
WASS on the planter, which is two steps back.
olf20 / Bob

Edited by olf20 4/27/2017 06:10

AVP_Matt

Posted 4/27/2017 08:48 (#5985112 - in reply to #5984776)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Hennepin, IL

Had nearly the same thing happen to a customer running a 750/autopilot on the case ih dealers radio network. No idea how old the 750 is but I'm pretty sure it's not glonass unlocked. Tried troubleshooting the whole planter and even switched 20/20s out and still didn't fix it. Stuck an AL 6000 receiver on to run the planter and haven't had the problem in 2 years. Like you, I think it's a Trimble issue that has something to do with inputting corrections and exporting nmea strings at the same time. The autopilot would never disengage or even have the slightest hiccup when the planter would skip.

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 06:03 (#5984768 - in reply to #5984039)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

That is correct, except we heard from our dealer "the only common thing
is DigiFarm". That's where we got talking to Dave.
olf20 / Bob

breken

Posted 4/26/2017 19:53 (#5984063 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Flora Indiana

This is not only a Trimble problem. We have fought this same issue with a agleader geosteer for years with rowflow. The only way we could get it to not skip was to use radar as primary speed. This year with vdrive we still used the geosteer. I had problems at first but had the nmea output rate at 10hz. I lowered it to 5hz and planted the rest of our corn without a skip. We also use digifarm for our rtk correction.

Edited by breken 4/26/2017 19:54

cutlass87400

Posted 4/26/2017 20:19 (#5984115 - in reply to #5984063)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Western IL

This is 2nd year for vdrive for us and ran rowflow with jd clutchs for a few years before that with trimble fmx and have been using digi farm pretty much since they started and probably have the older fmx but have never had a map look like what your saying or showing but keep us updated hopefully someone will get a fix soon

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 06:13 (#5984781 - in reply to #5984115)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

Its in the hands of Trimble and Precision. Trimble is to big
to care, and Precision doesn't want to mess with it.
SAD
olf20 / Bob

gostate

Posted 4/27/2017 10:09 (#5985247 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

western iowa

Has anyone tried using radar for speed input instead of GPS? It would seem that would eliminate any gps gremlins?

cropdude

Posted 4/27/2017 11:15 (#5985385 - in reply to #5985247)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NE SD

I had a customer with the same issue running DigiFarm on a pro700 that is sending GPS info to a 20/20 with rowflow. He told me it is the speed source coming out of the DigiFarm. Look at your planter speed maps to confirm. Using radar as a speed source should fix his problem. Its a DigiFarm/20/20 issue from what I have been told.

Edited by cropdude 4/27/2017 13:14

caseihfarmer

Posted 4/27/2017 12:52 (#5985558 - in reply to #5985385)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

East Central, Nebraska

what speed source coming out of digifarm? digifarm is a correction service.

with your assumption why wouldn't it do it in every circumstance.

so lets break this down. it does it when someone is feeding corrections from digifarm, but also does it when your feeding corrections from another source, right? also i run an older trimble running digifarm rtk feeding nmea to an agleader display and it does not do it, but it does when using that combination and precision planting products? when we put those pieces together what do we get?

i am betting i can guess who told you its a digifarm issue.

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 13:29 (#5985630 - in reply to #5985558)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

Exactly! That's the problem, one or two people at Precision
has made a statement. From there NO TESTING has been
done. Rumor has it that Monsanto had severe trouble at their
plots, using Trimble. Crew came out found problem, fixed
problem.
Why can't farmers get problems fixed????
This goes much deeper that your signal / my signal.
There is more than one problem out there. Funny how
everything gets dumped into one vendor(s).
Again just my opinion with my experience.
olf20 / Bob

Edited by olf20 4/27/2017 13:31

PE.

Posted 4/27/2017 15:55 (#5985832 - in reply to #5985630)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

WC MN

Just switched to TMX2050 and 20/20 with vSets. Have had skips like you show with both FMD and FMX with MN Cors RTK running hydraulic drives in the past. Interesting to note Precision insisted on radar on the planter so will see if that matters. Trial run seems to work, when snow melts and ground thaws we can try again, ha, ha.

olf20

Posted 4/27/2017 16:13 (#5985857 - in reply to #5985832)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

Thanks for the feedback! Why should we have to switch anything.
Design it right!!!
Thanks for the feedback, and keep us posted.
olf20 / Bob

Fingers77

Posted 4/27/2017 17:13 (#5985965 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

You should've been around in 09 trying to get a FMD and a 20/20 to play nice. I went through all of that then. Finger pointing and little result. I fixed it on my own.

Good luck with the Radar fix, I hope it works.

farmboy0984

Posted 4/27/2017 19:25 (#5986237 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Ford County, IL

I am running ag leader 6500 with digifarm RTK and have had no problems with my vdrives not working. have planted close to 1000 acres already this spring with no problems. Everything of mine is prescriptions too.

Noble1

Posted 4/28/2017 06:50 (#5987020 - in reply to #5983822)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Arco MN

I have several of the same system running and working well.
You need to be pulling NMEA out of the Nav controller.
Also there have been some fixes to the NMEA data to address some of the issues you describe in the latest releases for the nav and FMX.
I would try them for sure. 13.20 for the nav. And 10.13 for the FMX.
We had similar issues and these seemed to fix them.

olf20

Posted 4/28/2017 06:57 (#5987034 - in reply to #5987020)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

NW ILLINOIS

Specifically what were the problems?
Thanks
olf20 / Bob

Noble1

Posted 4/28/2017 07:37 (#5987113 - in reply to #5987034)
Subject: RE: Precision Planting & Digi Farm with Trimble FMX

Arco MN

There were random errors in speed that would come much like you are describing. I beleive they have these fixed and have in proved the position reporting out of the Nav controller as well.

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