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Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?
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1887fff
Posted 10/3/2016 10:59 (#5561586)
Subject: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Western Illinois		AgTalk--

My brother-in-law purchased a planter equipped with in-furrow starter fertilizer. This is something we have never done before, but feel it could be very valuable. Here are my initial thoughts--please post any yield results, anecodotal evidence, or thoughts to help us plan for 2017. I know we have time, but what we think about for spring 2017 will affect our strip-till-banding for this fall.

1) We have a 300gallon tank on 24 row planter. That's 50 acres (1 bag per box) or 80 acres (1.75 bags per box). That would be 6gallons per acre or 3.75 gallons per acre, respectively.
2) Thinking about a balanced solution that is LOW SALT for in-furrow. Ideally, some nitrogen and phosphorus with some calcium delivering micros: Zn, B, Mo. We are applying Sulphur and Magnesium with the strip-tillage bar in the fall, 20#/acre apiece.
3) Would we be just best off with just AMS, 32% or some phosphate?
4) Any need or recommendation for a humate that could buffer the salt-index of something better (we have started using a humate with our dry P/K fertilizer in the strip-till rig for this reason)?

Thanks for all the advice and happy harvesting everyone!
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hey
Posted 10/3/2016 11:37 (#5561648 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


I may be a little different than most but I dont see a true value in Low Salt Row Starter.  For what you pay for the product you could be putting dry down in its place.  I will say that I have looked into this for the past 5 years and every year we see something different.  You will notice a difference in color and seed emergence compared to not having it but we rarely see a yield increase that will pay for the product and equipment.  What we have seen work is switching from the in furrow to a system putting 28% and ATS either 2x2 or dribble it on top with the planter.  This will get you some nitrogen and sulfur to really get the plant going.  Every year that we do this we see good results.  We are able to also spread out our nitrogen from one pass to up to three.  

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Trapshooter1
Posted 10/3/2016 11:47 (#5561662 - in reply to #5561648)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Grandpa calls it God's country, NEIA		Just run 10-34-0. Really like our starter fertilizer, especially in wet springs. Anybody doing Corn on Corn should be using starter IMHO.
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Farminstrong
Posted 10/4/2016 17:54 (#5563821 - in reply to #5561662)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


wcia		starter just works always does BUT N and thiosol placed 2*2 works better. theirs no one answer but it seems their is a 1+1= 5 for both together not y dropped or spread later I have some trials ill pass on after harvest..
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BronsonA2150
Posted 10/3/2016 12:24 (#5561719 - in reply to #5561648)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


SC IA		I disagree. We've been testing 6-24-6 on our corn in our test plots for probably 3-4 years. This is also on ground that has very high phosphorus levels. Every test comparing bare seed to 5 gallons of starter has at least paid for itself and I'd say on average yields a 7-8 bushel increase in yields (sometimes more and the worst has been about 5 bushel). Even at the worst increase it's still paying for itself unless you get into the really expensive stuff. And that doesn't even factor in the plants generally being 2-3 growth stages ahead all season leading to dryer grain in the fall. Here's a picture comparing the entries in our plot in 2015 where we had a cold wet spring

Edited by BronsonA2150 10/3/2016 12:27




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PatCMO
Posted 10/4/2016 22:28 (#5564447 - in reply to #5561719)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Pilot Grove, Missouri		Just a quick question. Where you don't apply the starter are you broadcasting or otherwise replacing the equivelant to the starter. If not the test is biased for the starter to will. Patrick
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17821x
Posted 10/3/2016 12:20 (#5561714 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


NE Iowa		Here is a copy of some numbers I ran last January of what in-furrow costs. I haven't reran them with projected 2017 costs but it gives you an idea of how little yield gain it takes to pay for cheap starters like 10-34-0:


In my mind it doesn't cost near as much to apply in-furrow starter as most people think. I used to use low salt 6-24-6 but seems like the price went crazy so switched to 10-34-0. We have heavy ground and 5 gallon per acre in-furrow has never caused me a problem. I find that when comparing liquid starters it is best to figure the costs of what the nutrients would have cost if you spread dry. Pound for pound liquid is always higher then dry fertilizer. In my opinion a crop needs a certain amount of N, P, and K whether it comes from starter or just broadcast / banded dry fertilizer. So any starter you apply can be subtracted from your other fertilizer applications. So in my mind the added cost of starter is just the "premium" of the liquid vs. the dry. I'll just run some numbers based on current costs in my area. Yours may vary:

Assumptions:
Urea (46-0-0) = $365/ton = $0.397/# of N (urea is only $305 per ton but it costs about $60/ton to add Agrotain if broadcast and not incorporated)
DAP (18-46-0) = $455/ton = Based on urea cost the N in DAP is worth about $143/ton = $455 - $143 = $312 / ton (cost of the P only) = $0.339/# of P


10-34-0:
Weighs about 11.7 #/gallon typically. So each gallon contains 1.17# of N and 3.98# of P. So based on the cost of dry there is $0.465 of N and $1.349 of P per gallon for a total of $1.814 per gallon. 10-34-0 is costing around $575 per ton. So that is $3.36 per gallon. So at 5 gallon per acre you are spending 5 x ($3.36-$1.81) = $7.75 over spreading the equivalent dry fertilizer.

Like I say your costs may vary but I think these are in the ballpark. If you agree with my logic of the crop needing the same amount of nutrients no matter what form it comes in then using 5 gallons of 10-34-0 only costs $7.75 per acre. So it only takes less than 2.5 bu/acre to cover the costs. I'm all for cutting costs but I don't think in-furrow starter is the place to skimp. These numbers will look different if you are using high cost low salt starters.
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Boone & Crockett
Posted 10/3/2016 15:04 (#5561898 - in reply to #5561714)
Subject: Marking thread Nt


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newholland4life
Posted 10/3/2016 12:46 (#5561760 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?



New castle PA		Yeah, I like 150# MAP 2x2. Let's just say I don't see purple seedlings very often...
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Drbrown
Posted 10/3/2016 14:00 (#5561839 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Hopkinsville, KY		So-ok service out of Carthage would be a good place to start.
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Tech man
Posted 10/3/2016 14:19 (#5561860 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


The desert of MN.		Can anybody show any studies that actually show it yields better? Most that I have found there was little to no yield response. The corn might look better early in the season but looks don't equate to yield. Not saying it doesn't hurt the crop but it has to pay to use it. Anybody have any trials with in furrow on dry land sand? We have looked into this in the past but its hard to find any info on our soil type. 1-2% organic mater and low CEC. We use dry 2x2. In the past it seemed like the corn would come out of the ground and then stall out for a couple weeks. It looked pale and just did not want to go. Last year we upped the total amount of starter and also upped the amount of dap in the mix and the corn on corn definitely got going better this year. Corn on Beans it was not an issue. Not sure if it is the ground was warner faster or if it is more N available from the beans the year before.
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BronsonA2150
Posted 10/3/2016 16:02 (#5561979 - in reply to #5561860)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


SC IA		I will look for our plot results tonight if I remember. But our soils are mostly clay instead of sand. That may make a difference
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wire farms
Posted 10/4/2016 18:20 (#5563850 - in reply to #5561860)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Nebraska
Tech man - 10/3/2016 12:19

The corn might look better early in the season but looks don't equate to yield. .


May be true....but, it gets it going earlier, gets it up and moving = mature dryer corn in the fall which we need in Nebraska, not many people dry corn here, put right in dry bin out of field. Ive used in furrow pop-up for about 5 years now and wont go without. Depends on your ground, we have a lot of high PH soil so phos. and K is tied up so we need that kickstart early in the furrow.

I like your idea of using dry 2x2, Have a friend that farms a lot of sandy circles, low CEC, Low PH, Dry works awesome for them there.
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CleverName
Posted 1/14/2018 20:22 (#6505560 - in reply to #5561860)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


The one row sensor wasn't working

Edited by CleverName 1/14/2018 20:24




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Tyv92
Posted 10/3/2016 20:11 (#5562305 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Wayne County IL		Granted I am a dealer of starter and other productsbut we use an ultra low salt 8-29-2. We also use a biological product with it and have seen great results with it. This was my first year as a dealer but have used products from my company for a couple years. Starter looks good early and I'd say most years not all but most adds 5-8 bu on average. This year by doing anywhere from 4 to 8 gal an acre the side by side comparisons I've weighed have showed a 7.5 to an 18 bu gain when using the biological product with starter vs just starter.
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farmcdc
Posted 10/5/2016 20:34 (#5565929 - in reply to #5562305)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Fremont, NE		Brand of starter Tyler?
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1887fff
Posted 10/6/2016 21:50 (#5568231 - in reply to #5562305)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Western Illinois		What's the products, including the biological, and approximate cost?

Thanks!
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Wheelsup
Posted 10/4/2016 21:02 (#5564223 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: Warning! Cannot use boron in-furrow


Thumb of Michigan		Any amount of boron in furrow will hurt germination, that would be bad. Using 5 gallon 6-24-6 & 1.5 gallon 4-13-17-1s , 1 pint Zn, Mn, Ca.
2-3% Organic matter on loamy sand soil. As stated, gets crop moving early, take the dollars out of your dry phosphorus. Always pays for itself but gains heaps in cold spring. This year we've been short of rain but early root growth looks to overcome some of the stress so far.
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Coastal
Posted 1/15/2018 04:48 (#6506045 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


Nt
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CleverName
Posted 2/25/2018 20:16 (#6605148 - in reply to #5561586)
Subject: RE: Best Corn Starter Fertilizer?


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