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Top Dry grain bins
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 15:42 (#2876861)
Subject: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
hello , new to this form but have read lots of posts online, decided to join as i am looking for some input on grain dryers.
Currently my farm has no grain drying period. or storage really for that matter ( 7000 bushels )
i m starting with nothing, the idea of a top dry grain dryer with it's storage under it seems to be the cheapest way to get the capacity and storage i'm looking for.
so my question is what are the draw backs of the system vs a tower or portable.

running a JD 9770sts with 12 row head so 2400 bph is lot to deal with. my idea was to put two 36ft dia 11 ring top drys from gsi (1072bph 10pts removed on each dryer, so 2144 bph), run batch with them as well as a 78000 bushel storage tank behind it. 3500 bushel wet tank, one elevator to run the whole thing, unload, load dryer, load trucks , elevator pulls from the big bin and two dryers, wet tank sits over same convyor that unloads trucks .

any input or ideas would be great!

Edited by Chris 924 2/5/2013 15:53
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farmer01
Posted 2/5/2013 15:49 (#2876867 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Jackson County....... Southwest Minnesota
10,000 bu plus wet bin with wet leg
1500 bu per hour continuous flow dryer with air system to storage bin
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NEILFarmer
Posted 2/5/2013 16:16 (#2876897 - in reply to #2876867)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Morris, IL
I'd lean that way as well. You can get big flat bottom wet storage for $3 or less a bushel (12,500+). New or used dryer and blower system. Use blower to go into what ever size storage bin you want. I've though about top dry myself, just seems a stand alone dryer is better for future. Easy to trade dryer for newer or larger one if needed. Easy to add storage with blower system. System i describe above (even if all new) is probably cheaper then one your talking and i think i'll feel more comfortable letting dryer run through the night then a batch top dry. We are trying to do something similar to this on smaller scale this year if we can get electrical figured out. I can give you a tip, your going to need large amount of power no matter which system you go with. Start working on getting power now, really.

Edited by NEILFarmer 2/5/2013 16:19
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 16:32 (#2876927 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
i know what your saying niel and farmer 1 , the problem is where i'm from ( nova scotia , canada ) here the price of a 1000bph dryer plus to legs load, unload, is more than the two big top drys which still beat it on bph dryed plus the got 58000 bushels storage with them, for less money . plus you need v bottom wet tanks and still have to get crop into wet storage, my concern is will the top drys work. expanding is just another leg with more top drys or tower on the other side of big bin, when i started thinking of building , a tower was the way we were going to go and still might. i just want to know if they work. it's more or less $50,000.00 more than the storage tank you would have to build anyway.

we have 3 phase power
thanks for thoughts!
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NEILFarmer
Posted 2/5/2013 17:00 (#2876987 - in reply to #2876927)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Morris, IL
You might be right on V bottom in nova scotia Canada. Down here in the 10,000 bushel plus they are a major premium. But i'm a lot further south, 30% is probably normal up their. We are going with lot smaller setup, going with 5,500 bushel hopper. Over the course of it's life the extra $1 will be worth it vs. a flat bottom. But larger you go flat bottom gets cheaper and over 8,000 bushel you hare to go with commercial hopper bin $$$.

I'm guessing you currently haul all grain to elevator, so you dump into legs at elevators. Just because elevator has them doesn't mean you do at least year one. 13" auger will move a lot of grain and i'd guess 1/5 the cost. Now you go so tall auger won't work but for wet storage your probably not going to get that tall, 80-100' auger should cover you for sure. I'd put that money towards CF dryer horizontal dryer.

Or if you want tower dryer you need wet leg. But you can still use blower to unload dryer. Neighbor in this are has that setup. Wet leg to feed tower dryer and wet bin, unload trucks, and unload dry bins come winter. He then blower the dry corn to dry bins with blower system. Sure you can plan on dry leg for future but even 2000 bph dryer can be handled with blower system.

With big enough wet bin you really only need dryer capable of 1000-1500 at 25% (guessing 25%-30% is what you harvest up in Canada). With that you would want 20,000+ bushel wet bin.

3 phase right at the farm, you don't know what an advantage that is.



Edited by NEILFarmer 2/5/2013 17:01
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Gunner
Posted 2/5/2013 16:43 (#2876953 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: RE: Top Dry grain bins



Modena, Wisconsin

Two 36 foot top dry's will do a lot of corn in a day.  The problem I see with the system is not enough wet storage.  You don't even have enough for two hours of running. I run one 30 foot and have 10,000 bushel wet storage. Add a 10-15,000 bushel flat bottom bin with an oversize fan and use it for wet to feed the dryers.  At the end of the season you feed batches to the dryer and use the wet bin for additional storage. If you get corn down around 20% you won't keep up with the dryers. The one thing I would do is set them up as contious flow and not batch systems. You will gain lots of capacity that way.

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WTW
Posted 2/5/2013 16:49 (#2876963 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Winkler, Manitoba Canada
What is the ambient temperature when you want to run your dryer. The cooler it is the less a top dry would appeal to me, as the humidity problem in the bin will compound.
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 17:31 (#2877050 - in reply to #2876963)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
from 0 to 15c temp
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 17:40 (#2877070 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
gunner , they conflow , is it easy to set up to run that way , would leg have to run non stop ? as for wet store , average field size here is round 20 acres , so lots of moving each day the idea is the combine more or less fills one in an hour, fill the other the next hour, then have 3500 bushel v tank i already own that would sit over same conveor as we unload with we could fill 3 hour , then 1st top dry should be done cycle to be filled again , with moving around threw day and our trailers plus cart i figure we'll make it threw first year then up grade to bigger v bottom wet the next year maybe 10000 bushel.
you like yours for most part?
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Gunner
Posted 2/5/2013 18:16 (#2877137 - in reply to #2877070)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Modena, Wisconsin

They are pretty easy to set as continious flow.  Computer controls when they dump and calls for refill.  You should not need to have leg run all the time.  Mine controls auger run by electric cart and the auger in wet bin and turns them on and off as corn is needed.  We have had our top dry about 30 years and as a continious flow for about 5 now and really like it. You get good quality, high test weight corn out of them.

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redoak
Posted 2/5/2013 19:08 (#2877295 - in reply to #2877070)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


deep SW On.
Chris all I can say is my best friend has had a top dry for maybe 22 yrs. and pretty trouble free--he uses overhead hopper,1 leg and then some dry corn bins...question about NS as when we where in Annapolis Valley in August there was some great looking corn and same on PEI -what yield do you expect? land cost? Looked like lots of chicken and dairy farms
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OntariOtis
Posted 2/5/2013 17:46 (#2877078 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Ilderton, Ontario
We built a facility a couple years ago. We THOUGHT we wanted a continuous flow drier when we started looking into things. We ended up with a Top Dry. Basically, they are simple, energy efficient, produce excellent grain quality and can be made quite versatile with the use of just 1 leg, 1 conveyor and 1 overhead. the overhead can then be used for shipping as well. Other benefits are: no noisy air system running continuously. You do have some reasonably inexpensive storage, although I wouldn't consider it for long term storage (the corn should be mixed out of the top dry into another container to allow for over and under dried layers in the topdry). We installed the autoflow system and that dryer runs through the night with out much supervision. when we get there in the morning the dryer is off, the grain is cool and ready to move. While the combine is getting greased, warmed up and the first truck filled we are emptying the dryer and ready to receive when the first truck arrives. 2 years into it and I wouldn't change much.
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 17:49 (#2877084 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
niel - corn is round 25% for the most part, right now we haul to elevator , and sell high moisture to dariy as well , both ways cost or lose to much money verses having own system , ( got to get away from it) the other problem is there is really no dryer capacity in nova scotia, the guy close to my farm can do 100 ton a day , this doesn't work well with a combine that will do 60 ton per hour lol. but same goes for the rest of the farmers round nova scotia, you fight to get drying time, there all full . only five dryers in province. so i can expect to dry alot for other producers as well . my big problem is getting enough storage that first year with out borrowing most of the farm lol!
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NEILFarmer
Posted 2/5/2013 18:56 (#2877247 - in reply to #2877084)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Morris, IL
Chris 924 - 2/5/2013 16:49

both ways cost or lose to much money verses having own system , ( got to get away from it)


Kind of what we are looking at. Been dealing with stirator bins but they are getting old, need another in the first place to have enough capacity. Others are getting old and need money put into them. Just makes sense to go to CF dryer. We are paying for this system if we build it or not. In illinois we have great loan program with FSA, 1% for 7 years, that helps.

You start talking about custom drying, that could be lot of bushels. Maybe you are correct and should be looking at legs rather then auger/blower, but get your wallet out.
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JDELV
Posted 2/5/2013 18:11 (#2877127 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: RE: Top Dry grain bins


central MI
Auto flow top dryers work great. I see a used 36 ' GSI 30 hp, 3 phase, with 8 " power sweep unload for sale in Michigan at Zook Farm Equip. In Alto, MI. 616-868-6195
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John In Ontario
Posted 2/5/2013 18:29 (#2877168 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Ripley, Ontario Canada
I am not sure I would go that way with corn that wet. I have a neighbour that drys 25-35% corn in one and the wet/dry layers can cause problems because the top dry doesn't mix. If you go top dry, I would set it up continuous so you get more even drying. I would also plan for more wet storage, it makes life a LOT easier.
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avaitor
Posted 2/5/2013 19:04 (#2877277 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


South of Springfield IL
You only need one Top Dry, one leg, and 15000 bus wet storage. I would run it as a continuous flow. Might want to think about installing 2 unloads, one back to leg and one that could be used as truck load out. On your unload back to the leg go as big as you can. I run mine 24/7 then completely clean clean drying camber, knock dust off of the underside of drying chamber, empty the storage area, then start all over again.
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bakerna4
Posted 2/5/2013 19:57 (#2877476 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Waldron, MI
Do a search for top dry bins on here and you'll find some old posts about this subject. We use Top Dry bins on our farm. We have 4 of them on 2 sites. They are very efficient and give you excellent grain quality. Ours are all batch systems and we have never had any problems with wet and dry layers although we pull the dry corn out almost daily in season and then leave them full at the end of the year. As long as you use your aeration fan after your done drying for a few days I wouldn't be concerned with that. I've heard guys have problems with dust build up on the underside of the drying floor in the continuous flow setups. NEILFarmer is right about making sure you have enough power, we don't have 3phase available and had to put in a generator to run everything. The biggest downside to Top Dry bins the I see is once you go with them the only way to expand is build another bin, that's why we have 4 of them now. Overall we are very happy with them. They are a simple and trouble free way to dry corn.
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cat75D
Posted 2/5/2013 20:44 (#2877657 - in reply to #2877476)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


We have a large farm by us that has two 36 ft top dry bins and runs two combines with 8 row heads and can never fall behind drying, we have a 30 ft top dry and love the quality and efficiency you would be very happy with that setup
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Chris 924
Posted 2/5/2013 21:43 (#2877865 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
john in ont- think we would empty into big bin every morning till end of harvest so should mix and avoid the layers problems, they have a twin burner twin fan opt which increases cft per min . think i'd go with that as well. thanks for thoughts!

redoak - corn yields , round 150-160 would say is average. there coming out with better varitys every year for our heat units, seems every year were gaining 10 bushels or so these last few.
land prices, who buys land! lol just kidding , it's anywhere from $2500 per acre to owners just letting you use it cause no one else will there is a huge amount of idle land in nova scotia. the down side is the fields are small (20 acre is the avg) and there everywhere, low in nutriance, ph is low in most of them as well. we can add 300-400 per year if we want, people call asking if you want to use it , the key is getting a group of fields in one spot! thanks for thoughts!

baker- four of them , how many combines is this supporting ? thanks!




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bakerna4
Posted 2/5/2013 22:33 (#2878025 - in reply to #2877865)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Waldron, MI
Two combines with 8 row heads. The two sites are 35 miles apart and one has two 30' and the other has a 30' and a 24'
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SNB
Posted 2/6/2013 07:06 (#2878416 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Sussex Corner, New Brunswick
Where in NS are you located Chris? I'm guessing not in the Valley, should be lots of drying capacity down there.
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Chris 924
Posted 2/6/2013 10:16 (#2878851 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
SNB - Truro , i shipped some to the vally this past season , but even they were full down there. there was still corn out in the valley mid dec that they couldn't get off because of no place to go with it.
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SNB
Posted 2/7/2013 05:37 (#2880794 - in reply to #2878851)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Sussex Corner, New Brunswick
Everyone seemed to fill up this year. we were fortunate here, managed to move enough out to finish Dec 18.
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Chris 924
Posted 2/7/2013 09:50 (#2881354 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
SNB how many acre a year you putting in?
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SNB
Posted 2/9/2013 03:35 (#2885478 - in reply to #2881354)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Sussex Corner, New Brunswick
Putting in and growing are two very different things here. We grow around 50 ac of corn and another 50 of beans. We plant close to 700 ac corn, 400 ac beans and another 400 of cereals. We dry our own corn and then custom dry another 3-400T. Custom combine 300ac cereals, 400 ac beans and 8-900 ac corn.

Email is in profile drop me a line if you want.
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Chris 924
Posted 2/17/2013 14:02 (#2905615 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
We'll have around 2200 acres this year. 1500 of corn 500 beans 200 barley , also another 1500 of corn to plant for other farmers. have a line on a 1400 acre farm for rent but don't think i could get it in the ground this year if i tried. but might try to get some of it. what do you run for a combine?
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SNB
Posted 2/20/2013 10:09 (#2912502 - in reply to #2905615)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Sussex Corner, New Brunswick
Two combines, 1987 Gleaner L3 with 16' flex with air reel and a 6R corn head. Also just bought a 1997 Gleaner R62 last year. It came with a 20" flex with air reel and a 6R corn head.
If you are coming to the machinery show I will be at the Pioneer booth Friday and Saturday.
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SNB
Posted 2/20/2013 10:13 (#2912513 - in reply to #2912502)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins



Sussex Corner, New Brunswick

Some Pics.

A friend of mine north of London Ontario put up the grain handling system a couplke years ago. There is a top dry behind the large grain bin on the right. The elevated hopper acts as both a wet tank and a loadout tank.

The two combines.



Edited by SNB 2/20/2013 10:26




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Chris 924
Posted 2/22/2013 11:50 (#2917959 - in reply to #2876861)
Subject: Re: Top Dry grain bins


Nova Scotia
your friends set up looks nice. the combines look good too , never been in a gleaner, you must like them good if you got another one, i'll be at the farm show, i'l drop in.
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