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Iowa | I have a 4 inch DMC system with 15hp that has never had close to the amount of capacity it was suppose to have. I've done all the obvious things suggested by the dealer and company including the use of a new air lock. My next move, although not suggested, is to try a different pulley to speed up the pump. I don't really care if the pump gets destroyed at this point. About the only thing left to try is a new pump anyway. The current level of performance simply is not acceptable. The dealer has another DMC pump available for sale. Are there any other companies that have a good pump available for a 4 inch system in Iowa? |
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Chippewa County, MN | I've had the same issues with a 5" system. It's capacity is supposed to be around 1200 bph. I was dumping a 270 Farm Fans dryer and couldn't run the meter rolls over 60% without overloading the air lock. That's about 500 bushels per hour. The dealer is coming out to put a bigger pulley on the air lock motor, but we won't know if that helps until next year. |
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Sac & Story county IA | Have you used an amp meter on the motor wire? Or a volt meter when the unit is at full load? Just to make sure you are getting the full performance. |
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midwest | I had mine set up to piggyback a 7.5hp motor along with the 15hp. I built a bracket to mount the 7.5 above the 15, then put a 4 belt pully on the blower and a 2 belt on the 7.5. That setup worked very well, if I remember it gave me another 10-20% more capacity. I started the 15 first then pluged in the 7.5, I had it all wired together so if something happened it would all shut down. When i started the 7.5 you could see the amps fall! I still have all the pulleys, shield(home made), motor mount(home made), and belts. I do not know where you're located but I would like to get rid of them if intrested, since I went up to a larger drier and 5" system. |
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The Original Lock Springs Rver Rat | I have had a 4 inch system for 12 years,it will handle 800 bushel/hour and we have some long runs one to a 48' 12 ring bin which it handles easily. Your problem sounds to me like it is your motor. We run a 20HP motor with a phase converter. We tried a couple 15 hp motors and they did not last a week before burning up. |
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Iowa | I wish it was the air lock overloading. A different sprocket on that would be a simple and likely effective fix.:) More horspower will not make much difference on this pump unless the extra power is used to spin it faster. It might make a difference if it was a bigger pump. The motor draws about 30 amps if I remember correctly. 300 bu/hr will plug it on runs of greater than 200 effective feet. 250/hr works at 200 effective feetor less. 15 hp ought to be able to do a lot more than that. Another run of about 300 feet will knock it down to about 200 bu/hr, depending on test weight. |
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Leesburg, Ohio | We have had the same system, but branded Farm Fans, for four seasons now. (It's a Farm Fans design, all owned by the same outfit now, I think.) It is taking dry grain away from a Farm Fans 2125 dryer at about 800 to 900 bu/hr. It is only rated at 700 bu/hr with the single phase 15hp motor that we have, similar to your's. Our runs are fairly short, (about 140' tops), and our capacity increased this year by about 100 bu/hr after we moved our dryer to it's new location closer to the leg and bins. (Longest run used to be about 200'.)
It makes a big difference how the grain pipes are routed, and the number of turns in the grain path. Each turn is equal to another 20' of pipe. vertical or sloped runs are equal to double the pipe length. Do everything you possibly can to eliminate turns in the grain pipe. The air pipe from the blower to the airlock is not critical...if you have to choose between turns in the pipe after or before the airlock, make them before.
I would start by checking amperage draw and voltage on your 15 hp motor if you haven't already. I don't think a small increase in pulley size on the motor would hurt anything, and long as the amperages stay where they should.
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East of Dowagiac Michigan | The initial accelleration of the corn is very important, I think 12-20 times the pipe diameter (48-80" straight flat pipe) is recomended before any turns especially a turn up.
edit: oops, I really meant to reply to tigger
Edited by lylefarm 11/20/2008 10:38
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Iowa | Thanks, There is about 20 feet of straight line before the first turn. The "effective" lenghts I listed above included adjustments for turns and vertical elevations. I got the dryer slowed down, some space in the wet bin, and someone arriving to hual some grain. I'll head out to the field for now, and get back to this when I get the wet bin full again. |
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East of Dowagiac Michigan | that should be plenty. |
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Sac & Story county IA | Tie this blower on;
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lamson-blower-and-motor-40-hp_W0QQitemZ15030964...
Seriously, if you are on 3 phase power, that amp reading is OK, if single phase, that is about 6 horsepower. There should be performance charts for your blower to see if the blower can be speeded up for more performance or if you are at the end. |
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SC IL | I have same system behind a 116 GSI dryer. My capacity can be pushed to a little over 800bph on close run. Look at your amp meter, on a 15hp you don't want to go over 65 amp continously without leaving a little margin for error. DO NOT get a new blower from your local bin dealer, especially DMC/GSI, you will really get hosed! Look up "ROOTS" on net and get into their distributorships. You can pick up a new or rebuilt blower or any other blower/airlocks for a fraction of the cost. Hint: for the hours/seasonal use of the system the distributor advised to not even think about new units, they have rebuilt units on the shelf ready to go. They usually fail in ag situations as these due to non-use for extended periods of time. |
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Iowa | I now have the blower running about 30% faster than it was running with the standard pulleys. The single phase, 15 hp motor is now drawing about 40 amps. It was more accurately drawing about 30 amps before. The dryer is now discharging at about 300 bushels per hour instead of a little over 200. This seems to be working for now. All it needs to do is hang together for another 80000 bushels. I will otherwise be looking for another pump a little sooner than I had hoped. Thank you for your suggestions. |
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East of Dowagiac Michigan | I put one together for a guy this fall. Seems like it had a motor sheave about twice as big as the blower sheave. It was a 16 hp 1 phase motor 1725 rpm.
edit: -1 pt spelling
Edited by lylefarm 11/20/2008 21:29
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North West IA/western AZ | Need more info on "ROOTS". I'm sure your not talking about Alex Haley. Thanks |
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Iowa | In this case, the standard drive was about 9 inches and the driven was about 7.75 inches. I replaced the driven pulley with one slightly over 6 inches in size. The blower sounds a little different now.:) |
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Iowa | This is what I found: http://www.roots-blowers.com/air_blowers.htm |
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East of Dowagiac Michigan | That appears to have been what is recommended. http://www.dmc-davidmanufacturing.com/docs/english/manuals/airsystm... page 40-42
I thought there was more difference in the sheave size. |
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| Ours is a 4inch with a 10 hp motor on it. We've only dumped 300/hr in it but dealer said we should be able to go 500/hr with that motor, 15 hp would push it to 700bu. This is a farm fans.
Something has to be seriously wrong there. |
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Iowa | Exactly! This pump has never done close to what it was rated to do from day one. It still is not anything close to what it ought to be even with the faster pulley. Granted it used to be a little better than it is now, but I never got close to what I paid for. For now, I'm just trying to get done. The corn is wet, so dryer capacity is also limitted. It's not the air filter. It's not the placement of the air filter. You can remove the air filter entirely and it will still plug just like it will with a brand new filter. It's not the motor. It's not the size of the motor. It's not obstructions in the line. It's not the length or number or placement of turns in the line. It's not the air lock. It's not spikes in th e discharge rate from the dryer. It's not the (fill in the blank) issue this year anymore than it was last year, the year before that, the year before that, or any of those other times..... I do not really care how many times I am told how many of these units are working with no problems or how no one has never heard of one of these pumps not working up to rated specifications. It is not working here! It's the #%#^%$% PUMP!!!!!! It's not done what it should from day one. Being the good natured and patient man that I am, I let everyone give me the run around for years. I am absolutely fed up with this whole deal. I'm sure if I keep working with this pump next year and ask the dealer for some help, the response will be something like, "Did you check to see if the filter was plugged? You know a lot of times bee's wings get in there and cause these kinds of problems." At that point I will probably feel like choking the living $#%@# out of the next thing that crosses my path. It's not going to happen. There will be something different here next year. Life is too short to do otherwise. I do not mean to be negative to anyone kind enough to respond here. I'm just fed up with this situation, the people involved, and mostly myself for putting up with it for as long as I have. |
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SC IL | Buster 50 & tigger: put up your email and I can send you the distributor list for whole country, I went through Powered Equipment & Repair in Terre Haute, IN 812-232-0241
Good guys to work with, rebuilt less than 50% of bin dealer |
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Iowa | Thanks for your help.:) |
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| There are many variables that can cut effeciency of a pneumatic air system. Moisture content, how hot is the product? How much air in do you really have going though the blower? How long is the run? How many elbows? How worn is the airlock? Are the belts adjusted on the blower properly? Is the intake filter clean? Has my compression couplings become loose or have worn gaskets? Is the blower running at rated speed? etc.
On a 4", 15HP air system, if you are not getting 700 BPH, something is wrong.
If you decide to replace the air lock, choose the chrome option. This is well worth the extra price. We tell customers to expect double life on the chrome versus the cast standard airlock.
Our BRUNeumatic 415 system pushes 700 BPH using a roots blower and smoot air locks and all american parts.
The harvest season will be here for you know it, and many an idle air systems will be fired up once again.
If anyone has questions, please ask. We have been manufacturing pneumatic grain handling systems since 1977.
We chose smoot airlocks for their solid cast iron construction, attention to quality, the chrome option, the servicable packing rings, the fit and finish, and their life span.
Thanks;
Dale
www.bruningenterprises.com |
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| Curious that setup work pretty good? iam interested in setting me a drying bin with a single phase air system setup |
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| @jasonl |
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Fergus Ontario | With Pneumatic systems more air is not always the answer, if there is to much air in the lines there is not enough room for product causing the pressure to go up. Having said this I do not think a 4" system blowing product 200 to 250 effective feet with a 15 hp motor will reach 800 bu/hr. You may need more horse power. But before you do that I would recommend calling a Walinga Rep.
Have you ever looked into a Walinga system? http://www.agri-vac.com/index.php?id=144
If you are only looking for a new blower this is something Walinga offers as well.
To find a local Walinga rep please go to http://walinga.com/index.php?id=104
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| Tigger, I found this old post and your situation sounds exactly like mine--a 4" 15hp system that checks out ok but can only get about 250 bushel per hour out of it. I would like to know what you ended up doing? Did you ever find the fix? |
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North West IA/western AZ | I don't know where you are Dave but if you're having trouble with an air system, Steve Getsch at Custom Built Pneumatics can help. (507)526-2542 They do jobs all over the US. |
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Iowa | I finished with the 4" system that year in the snow sometime well after Thanksgiving. The 4" system was then replaced with a 5" system driven by two single phase 15hp motors. The 5" system works much better. |
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| We have a 4" system and have struggled for years. We went from 15 hp to 20 hp and still it didn't help much.
Ultimately we found that the breaker for the blower had loose wires. I tighten the lugs down as hard as I could and still could pull the wires right out, so we replaced the lugs then the next year the whole breaker.
Also we had assumed that our system was plugging because we were running it too hard. Actually we had a loose relay in the airlock, when it would trip it would shut everything down through the safety circuit and backup the blower. The air system doesn't show up in my dryer safety circuit diagnostic board so it was really difficult and took years to diagnose the loose relay. |
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4 inch Pneumatic Grain Transfer Systems
