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New Brunswick | I'm looking at getting my first manure tanker. My lagoon is about 1.1 million gallons and needs emptied twice a year. We have one hill to climb for our more distant fields. Most close fields are fairly flat. My biggest tractor is 120hp.
Questions:
1. What is the biggest tanker I can put on a 120hp tractor?
2. Do I need brakes?
Any info would be appreciated.
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| Whether you need brakes or not depends on how big of tank you put behind the tractor, if you go for the biggest tank the tractor can pull up the hill you better get brakes for going down the hill.
We need more info to know how big of tank you can pull. There is a huge disparity in what a "120 hp" tractor can handle. For starters are we talking 120 pto hp or engine? 2wd or mfwd?
Duals/singles?
How much does this tractor weigh?
Whats it got for a transmission?
Are you gonna pull knives or spray on top?
If its mfwd and duals, weighs good (14,000 lbs with the duals on would be a pretty good #), has a powershift or at least a partial power shift with syncronized gears you could maybe go up to 4800 gal but you'll definitely want brakes on the tank and it'd be best if they were hooked to the tractor brake pedal. |
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New Brunswick | Some tractor info:
Kubota M135X
118 hp PTO
10141 lbs
Intelli-Shift transmission 16F / 16R
MFWD
Single Tires, but option for duals is there.
We would like spray the manure on top.
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| I don't think I'd go over 3500 gal or so with that tractor. I just don't think the rear end looks heavy enough for the abuse that a manure tank bouncing on the drawbar would give it. Overall it's not really heavy enough for much bigger than that either. |
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Sunnyside, WA | I would go 3000 to 3500 with that size tractor. Flotation tires will make a difference in the field, but on the road you will be shifting down if you hit any kind of hill. Pulled a 4000 gallon with a 160 hp 2wd and duals (Case 2390) most of the time and it was ok except in our largest hills. Hauling manure takes a long time if you don't have enough hp. Also pulled with a CIH 7120 MFWD, no duals. Transmission was nicer, but never liked being on our hills without duals. Duals make a big difference.
We pull a 5000 gallon vacuum tank now that is built heavy. Pull it behind 200-250 hp. Need to be able to stop it going down the road.
Edited by J. Sheehan 1/17/2011 10:15
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Chilliwack, British Columbia | What kind of tanker are talking, as well? Self loading vacuum tanker, like a Loewen? Or a Houle type? Local custom guy went from a 4000G (CDN) Loewen to a 6000?G Houle with the same tractor, and says he handles the Houle better. Not knowing much about the Kubota, I can't say what would be best. We have 2 110PTO HP tractors, one I wouldn't hesitate to put a 4000G Houle on, the other probably wouldn't last the year on!
Good luck, be interesting to find out what you end up with.
Glenn
EDIT:
What are you doing now? Would a dragline setup work better? Or do you have too much too far down the road for that to work? IF most of your land is close, continue getting the far stuff custom hauled, and get a dragline setup for close to home. For the record, one of the local custom guys does cross non-busy roads, he rents a ramp type deal that the hose plugs into. Haven't seen it myself, but we may get him to use it this spring, if it works out on a feild we picked up last spring.
Edited by tonesaguy 1/17/2011 10:17
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Iowa | I suppose you could use that tractor in the short term if you have lots of cheap labor and plenty of time for application. If you need to get the job done quicker, I think I'd be looking for a different tractor (older, simple, solid, large frame, fwa, duals, 190+ pto hp) and a 6000ish gallon tank. Also, compare costs to custom application if available in your area.
That tractor (the Kabota) would seem very small "here" to be applying a million gallons twice a year because we can't plan on having much time to get the job done. DNR rules combined with the whims of mother nature make it so.
Edited by tigger 1/17/2011 14:03
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swmn | we pull a 4600 gal with our 8220 jd. 200hp. my opinion is to have too big of a tractor than to small just for weight. |
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Chilliwack BC | I would go up to 3000 gallons if it had steering and brakes, 2500 max if it didn't, especially if its tandem. Too large of a non steerable tandem would throw the tractor around. A 966 with duals here handles a 2500 single axle tank. I would not put a 3000 on it.
Remember that we're giving you two sizes of gallons here and you have to look at the mapdot to tell what the person is referring to. 3000 Imperial gallons = 3600 US gallons. Jasons tank is Canadian, therefore probably Imperial gallons. Jamesway tanks have Canadian and American flags on them with the gallon sizes to make this easier. |
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| I wouldn't go more than 3000 imperial gallons on that tractor... it's a fairly light one and you have that one hill. As for brakes... I wouldn't even ask the question, it's an obvious yes. I don't even know why these things are allowed on roads without brakes.
Only thing is 1.1 million gallons twice a year is a lot of manure for a 3000 gal tanker... you'll spend a lot of time doing it. We have a 3750 Houle on a MF 7485 (135 hp) and empty a 650000 gal Slurrystore twice a year. |
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Pine City, MN | Local guy here pulls a 4600 with a 4240.. |
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New Brunswick | A general reply:
I'm looking at a top load, not a vacuum tanker.
I have had custom operators up to this point. It was ok for close fields, but I found them very inefficient for more distant fields. They didn't seem willing to bring out the equipment to do the far fields efficiently. Paying by the hour when it is inefficient, can get expensive fast.
I didn't realize that some tankers were using imperial gallons, with Canada using SI units I assumed it was US gallons to cater to the larger US market, ie Nuhn, Houle, etc.
I have broken the draw bars off a Kunota more than once, so a weak back-end could definitely be a problem.
I would very much like to go to a drag line system in the future for the close fields. I have to deal with one non-busy road and 1000' to the first field, but then I have 200 acres. I also have to get the sand bedding completely out of my manure system before I look at it.
So taking in all the information, the general consensus seems to be a 3600 US gallon tanker with brakes for the Kubota tractor. I might look at something a bit bigger, and upgrade to a bigger tractor when funds permit. The budget is tight for this project and hauling 2.2 million US gallons a year cost effectively is going to be difficult.
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Lacombe, Alberta | We easily pull a 2000 gallon CDN Loewen vacuum tank with a JD 7510 (115 pto hp) and the tractor goes 40km/h full and empty. We now have a 3000 gallon CDN Loewen vacuum single axle tank on a JD 4555 with 155 pto hp and spread at 9 mph and its about the max the tractor can pull at those speeds without tearing up the grass while pulling. I think you could pull a 2500 gallon CDN tank at 5 mph without any problems and more if you drive slower. We tried a Case 2396 (120 pto hp) on a 3500 gallon CDN tandem axle tank but it jackknifed the first time it went from the road to the field. It could pull it but it couldn't turn it because of the tandem axle. Steering would be nice on a tandem axle especially the bigger your tires are because it wants to go straight all the time (We had 30.5L32 on the tandem axle tank). Brakes are also a good idea. |
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North America | my custom haulers pull Nuhn 6750's with 8120's. the tractors plays with them. another farmer pulls his 6750 with a 7800. says you know its back there but not too bad.
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nw NC | 2.2 million gal. at 3600 per load is 611 loads . Got time to do it? |
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Sumner GA, Located in southwest GA, | If he does 3 loads an hour, 8 hours a day, he's looking at 25.5 days of hauling a year, not to mention the abuse on a tractor. |
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| Dave,
I generally figure about 1 hp for 36 us gallons on level ground (like the midwest US) if there are any hills, I back down to 1 hp per 30 us gallons. I would reccomend a maximum of 3600 us gallons on a 120 hp tractor with the hills in your situation. I always reccomend steerable tanks to reduce wear on tires and the undercarriage.
As far as brakes-this should be an automatic yes. A couple of the engineering societies reccomend that the trailer can weigh no more that 1.5 times the towing vehicle. As a rule of thumb a manure tank weighs about 11 lbs/ us gallon when loaded (with non-sand laden manure). A 3600 us gallon tank would be 40,000 lbs-so I would definately reccomend brakes.
You may want to look at a larger tractor and tank-you'll spent a lot of time hauling manure otherwise.
Andy
P.S. I am a big fan of Houle's-I have learned a lot about manure working with them. |
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New Brunswick | Andy,
Thanks for the hard numbers, it gives some perspective. Everyone is saying about the same thing so it makes the decision easy. |
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Lake Park Iowa | From experience ask yourselves, 611 loads, 3 loads/ hour close by, 15 hours a day = 13 to 14 big days. Investment, fuel, TIME, you also milk, feed, etc, and I would guess maybe family time.
We have some really good custom haulers here, and that will make a difference on your decision. Maybe rent one for a week, and see what you think.
Good luck |
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Sumner GA, Located in southwest GA, | Any way possible to get a pivot to work for you, have seen quite a few used. Going to be a bit more upfront cost with that pivot, but for what you are talking about doing, that would be the only way I would consider doing that. Still need to get out all the sand, but that will be near any system, just good practice. Needs to be a good runny mix, nothing thick at all. Good dealer should be able to set up a system. Could also use it should you get into any dry spells as well. |
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Sizing a Manure Tanker
