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ontario | I have been looking at a few sprayers, most are pto drive but I have seen a few that are hydraulic driven.
Would a Allis Chalmers 7040 run a hydraulic pump on a sprayer?
Would it have enough flow for a sprayer? Probably a 40 foot boom
Would you rather a pto or hydraulic sprayer pump?
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Schlegel Farms, Hagerstown Indiana | I'm sure a 7040 could run a pump fine. There are different pumps for closed or open center systems, I'm not sure what an Allis is.
I have a PTO pump and have gotten along fine, but most of the newer sprayers have hydraulic pumps. |
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SW Ohio | Hydraulic pumps are cheaper to set up and the lack of a PTO shaft means less things to go wrong, like if you turn too sharp. Hydraulic pumps don't take a huge amount of oil, and are infinitely adjustable independent of tractor speed, to an extent. |
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N.W. Iowa | Dont know about the Allis, but I have had hydraulic pumps on the last 2 sprayers. I use a Case 7110 on mine with a 60' boom at 6 mph at 1600 rpm and 40 psi. I like the hydraulic pump because I only run the tractor at 1600 rpm and can turn as short as I need to. I can also adjust pressure on the flow control on the hydraulic remote. It takes 3 remotes to run the pump and booms. I did put a separate return line on the tractor so the oil would stay cooler. I would not buy one with a pto.
Edited by Hawk man 2/26/2017 07:20
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SW IL | ran a hyd pump on a AC 185 and then 7045 for many years......your tractor would run one good.....better than pto as you don't need to run tractor engine as fast |
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Manitoba | I ran a 100' Flexicoil sprayer for a lot of years with a hydraulic pump with a Case 4490. I don't know the hydraulic flow on that tractor but it worked well. |
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central ND/SD border | I have a hydraulic sprayer pump and use a JD 4430. On days over 80 degrees, the hyd hoses get so hot I can't touch them. When I've used our 4450 it doesn't get nearly as hot.
According to tractordata, the AC 7040 has the same pump flow as my 4430, but a lot larger capacity, so maybe it won't get as hot. |
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| ,I bought a used sprayer three years ago, I was fed up with pto driven ace pumps. rebuilding them, belts breaking etc. With reservation I purchased a Hardi. It is a pto drive. The best thing I like is crossing a washout etc, I can throttleback and maintain the same flo rate versus speed. Hydraulic pumps might react the same way? With the Hardi pump (diaphragm design) I can easily run 40 psi with a pto speed around 450 to 480 rpm. |
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Southern Colorado | It may be the way it is set up but I have to adjust the flow on our hydraulic pump fairly often. I wouldn't want a hydraulic pump unless I could adjust the flow from the cab. I do like the flexibility it has when going between different application rates you are not dependent on your tractor RPM. |
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CIL | We've been running a hydraulic pump on our 3 point sprayer for many years. Never had a problem with flow or reliability. Once in a while we've had to rebuild it, so we keep a used hydraulic pump (paid $200) on the shelf just in case. If you are running a pull type sprayer, I wouldn't like a PTO simply because of turning. We have an electric butterfly valve on our rig so we can set the hydraulic speed, then fine tune the pressure with that, right from the cab. |
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Dallas Center IA 515-720-2463 | Your Allis-Chalmers 7040 is Closed Center. As are all A-C 7000 and 8000 series tractors, except the model 7000.
They are a early type of LS closed center.
Will run a hydraulic spray pump just fine.
I have been using hydraulic spray pumps since 1980. Most of the time with White tractors, which are closed center PC.
And with a Deere 4630 which is also closed center PC.
On Ace pumps closed center PC tractors use a restrictor orifice, and the bypass fully closed.
On closed center LS the flow to the pump is controlled by the flow control on the tractor.
Again on pump fully closed the bypass.
I am fully convinced that most, almost all problems with hydraulic spray pumps are caused by not reading or following the OM.
Or by sales person who don’t know what they are talking about.
This is a Ace pump pub on setting up hydraulic pumps.
http://www.acepumps.com/_Assets/Literature/HYD-MAN%20REV%2012-11.pd...
With your 40’ boom the Ace model 204 will have plenty of flow.
But I am not sure if 204 work with LS. May need a 206.
As far as PTO vs hydraulic spray pumps go.
If I acquired a sprayer with a PTO pump on it, as soon as it was on my place, I would take the PTO pump off and throw it in the iron pile. Even if the pump was brand new.
Edited by Robert W Greif 2/26/2017 09:31
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ontario | thanks for the replies.
personally I would rather have a pto driven pump but I have seen a few hydraulic driven ones so it's good to know I can run one. |
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ontario | Robert, Thanks for the reply.
do you you have any experience with the Hypro pumps? I believe that is the one on the sprayer I am interested in |
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| I can't understand why anyone would want a PTO pump this day in age unless you have a tractor that couldn't run one. Most of the guys around me have PTO pumps and I just shake my head, it's ok to change, and once you do you will probably wonder why you didn't do it sooner. |
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| Maybe because I need all three outlets for the boom, simple, there are comments about turning, but with 60' booms that's not an issue either. |
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Dallas Center IA 515-720-2463 |
My only experience with the Hypro pumps is the one on a used sprayer I purchased.
Purchased the sprayer for the boom.
Used the sprayer proper for a nurse unit. But the Hypro was not a very big pump, slow filling. Replaced it with a Ace with 2” suction.
To be honest I use Ace because I understand them. Not that I could not learn Hypro.
Pretty sure Hypro does not use a restrictor office.
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Nevada, Iowa | You can find Hypro manuals online and probably get needed info there or a phone number to call. The Hypro manuals have been helpful to me in the past. |
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SE Illinois | Go to www.tractordata.com and look your Allis up. It will have the hyd gpm and whether you have open or closed spool system. I would start there first. |
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| We've run a pto pump for 29 years on our current sprayer. It's a hypro with the planetary drive system. I like it because as others have said, it's about like a ground drive system, slow down flow goes down, speed up, flow goes up. I realize a controller will compensate, but not as quickly, ( at least ours doesn't). Don't have to worry about hot oil, or wearing out the tractor hyd. Pump. Turning isn't a problem, if I turned any sharper the quick hitch would hit the sprayer. Weve only had to rebuild the pump once in 29 years, and we usualy spray 2000 plus acres a year. |
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Dallas Center IA 515-720-2463 | This is how to set up a Ace hydraulic pump for a Allis-Chalmers 7040 with a closed center LS system.
I would bet a Hypro is about the same.
http://www.acepumps.com/ihsg/apPumps.php?modelid=65&makeid=2&page=0
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ontario | Type: closed center
Capacity: 24.1 gal [91.2 L]
Valves: 2 or 3
Pump flow: 22 gpm [83.3 lpm]
Total flow: 45 gpm
Copied and pasted from tractordata |
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West Union, IOWA FLOLO Farm 52175 | Classic Robert W Greif pictures there Sir.....
Made me smile a bit.... |
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West Union, IOWA FLOLO Farm 52175 | I guess I'm odd..... I've went back to PTO pump....
Frees up the rest of the hydraulics for other things....
With field cruise, I can set max Revs...... and set things accordingly.
Perfectly good drive sitting there unused..... |
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Dallas Center IA 515-720-2463 | Notice I am parked kinda crooked. Also left the header lights on.
Kinda drunk because of all that Kool Aid I was about to receive.
At least I still have my Lexion jacket on.
Next week I am going from the Kinze dinner and auction Tuesday and Wednesday, then to the Triumph of Ag show in Omaha on Thursday.
Will have to go to the southwest part of Omaha and get redeemed for my sins in Moline.
Edited by Robert W Greif 2/26/2017 12:17
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| The oil doesn't heat the system any higher than it normally runs if it's setup correctly, and your hydraulic pump is turning and flowing oil most of the time anyhow. I personally would rather deal with a hydraulic motor and hoses than a PTO setup, and IMO hydraulic flow on these newer tractors is more consistant than PTO speed in the field. That is just my opinion, do what works for you. I would never think about a PTO pump unless I was spraying with a 1086 or a tractor with open center hydraulics. |
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| Not sure about oil heating, and probably depends on the tractor. But have a friend that pulled a 60 ' with a 4430 for years, and he said it got hot, and he even rigged a cooler up on the sprayer. And he's pretty sharp guy, so I'm sure it was set up right, and apparently he wasn't alone. See above post with 4430.
And yes. I do run an older open center tractor most of the time on the sprayer. Not going to buy a newer tracto to do the same job the old one as an do. |
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ECIL | Here is a link to the Hypro hydraulic pump selection guide:
http://legacy.hypropumps.com/en-us/Tools/SelectionGuide/ |
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NC Iowa Thompson | I just got a hypro Model 9403C pto pump on my last sprayer . was really surprise at how well it performed It run 140 gal per minute. at 104 # psi . not sure if that is big enough but handles a 80' boom at 8 mph at 15 gal / acre I have two sprayers and my other is HYD , I like that also but on hot day on a MX Case the oil does get very hot and have to stop and let oil cool sometimes |
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Running hydraulic sprayer pump.. Vs pto pump
