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John Burns
Posted 3/15/2020 09:34 (#8106153 - in reply to #8105563)
Subject: RE: believing everything



Pittsburg, Kansas

I agree with you and figured that was the case as is with most reasonable people. I just wanted to make the point that we rarely if ever find anyone we think is right 100% of the time.

It is the same way with Ivor Cummins. I hold his research findings in the highest regard, yet he also harps on the pastured eggs and grass fed beef. Not that I think there is anything wrong with those products and in fact I also think there may be some very slight advantage nutrient wise with them. But to date at least, I think any advantages likely would not outweigh the extra cost and the fact it would be hard if not impossible to feed the number of people the US now feeds by abandoning current agricultural practices. So just from a practical standpoint I don't think it is a workable idea for everyone. If people have the extra money for specialty food more power to them and also the producers that offer products for that market. We need to produce what the consumer wants to buy and I think there will be a certain market maintained for specialty products such as grass fattened beef and pastured eggs. But for the masses, not likely.

Me personally, I like grain/silage fattened beef with lots of nice marbling.

That is one thing the ones not associated with agriculture always seem to either get wrong or don't understand. First of all grain finished does not mean all they get is grain. They get silage/hay/haylage also because they are ruminants and need that. And corn silage is made from the whole corn plant which is a................. wait for it.............. a grass.

So I just kind of roll my eyes when I hear them go on. But I pay attention when they start talking about randomized controlled trials and scientific research.

There are a few of the doctors I follow do not get wrapped up in the organic grass fed thing. Virta Health, Dr Eric Westman and probably some others I can't think of off hand say you will do just fine on keto with regular stuff. Others like Ken Berry say the grass fed pastured eggs are better and buy the best you can afford, but acknowledge that not everyone can afford it and that keto will work just fine on regular stuff.

New stuff is still being learned. Just listened to one last night where the Australian doctor Paul Mason gave an interview where his idea on high Omega 6 oils had done an about face in the last year based on recent research. It has always been the idea that excess omega 6 in relation to omega 3 was the problem, so either cut down the 6 or increase the 3 to bring the ratio back to a better place. Among the doctors I follow that is generally the idea. Means get rid of vegetable oils basically. Well Paul still thinks a person should reduce seed oils from the diet, but it is because of the oxidation of the oils (even though they have antioxidants) that is the problem rather than the Omega 6 content. Is he right? I don't know but my point is not everything is completely known. He also thinks the microbiome in our gut is more of a reactive thing rather than something that we can change to make our health better. The gut microbiome is touted as the next Holy Grail to nutrition and he thinks it is not. Yet they have done fecal transplants to help Downs Syndrome patients. So who knows?

Here is the interview I am talking about. It is long and the host makes it a lot longer than it needs to be, but in between her interruptions the doctor says some pretty interesting things. Mason is another doctor that I listen to when he speaks as he is very knowledgeable.  But he does get pretty radical when it comes to things like lectins in plants. Are they as big of problem as he describes? Maybe, don't know. Doctors like Gundry (who is not against meat but is more plant based) would completely disagree with him and say that lectins can be managed through cooking. Both can bring up research to back up what they say. So I say we still don't know it all and in the mean time I try to hit some happy medium, recognizing that not every person may react the same way to different foods. Some people have problems processing fats, other people seem to have problems with certain plants. So maybe both of the doctors are right at least part of the time??? Depending on the situation? This video is long if a person wants to wade through it, but Mason seems to know his stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3Kt03qzcO8

There is still a lot we don't know from my perspective. But having said that, the research in the last 20 years has brought us a long ways in understanding a lot of health and metabolic disease issues, with that knowledge not always being reflected in current dietary guidelines or medical practice. And the diet has a lot to do with those issues. A lot more than some of us have realized in the past.

John



Edited by John Burns 3/15/2020 09:35
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