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chopping rolls
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Posted 11/21/2015 21:38 (#4911745)
Subject: chopping rolls


wis south border
For you no-til corn growers, is it beneficial to process the corn stalks with calmer rolls or the like? This is for corn on corn. Been playing with some no=til and have shark tooth row cleaners and question the need for chewing up the stalks at harvest.
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cbiers
Posted 11/21/2015 23:21 (#4911917 - in reply to #4911745)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls



Yes I think so. The confetti like pieces of stalk rot and disappear much faster than whole pieces of stalk from other rolls.
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FactoryFarmer
Posted 11/22/2015 08:35 (#4912276 - in reply to #4911745)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


N IL

We strip-till all of our corn and this is our first year with the Calmer rolls. So far I can see a huge difference in how fast the residue is disappearing. 

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Kevin NC IA
Posted 11/22/2015 11:08 (#4912647 - in reply to #4911745)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


NC Iowa
Second year with the Calmer rolls, I like the job they do and speed of residue breakdown. I do think they are a little pricey, but isn't everything these days.
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illinidirtfarmer
Posted 11/22/2015 13:29 (#4912921 - in reply to #4912647)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


WC IL
I'm thinking about the Calmer rolls, have seen how the stalks break down more quickly. I compared the price of the Calmer's to CIH/NH knife rolls, and they are about the same price, maybe even a little cheaper.
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Billdozer
Posted 11/23/2015 07:39 (#4914418 - in reply to #4911745)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


Western Wisconsin
We are 100% no-till and have had Calmer knife rolls on for 2 1/2 years (~2000ac) and they work great! Had a John Deere tech out to help find some electrical ghosts this year and he commented on how good a job they do. The residue seems to break down faster and whatever doesn't is sized smaller so the row cleaners work better in the spring.
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4WD
Posted 11/23/2015 07:43 (#4914427 - in reply to #4914418)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


NE part of SW Iowa

Billdozer - 11/23/2015 07:39 We are 100% no-till and have had Calmer knife rolls on for 2 1/2 years (~2000ac) and they work great! Had a John Deere tech out to help find some electrical ghosts this year and he commented on how good a job they do.

  The residue seems to break down faster and whatever doesn't is sized smaller so the row cleaners work better in the spring.

 

That's my biggest hope, for this next Spring = I just added Calmer's BT choppers, this Summer.

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Von WC Ohio
Posted 11/23/2015 07:53 (#4914448 - in reply to #4914427)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls



You got any pics of the BT choppers and how they process stalks. Do they have the revolving window also ?

I've already got JD knife rolls which are pretty sharp yet but they just don't seem quite aggressive enough in sizing the stalks for my liking.  I actually think the knife roll conversion on my 40 series did a better job than those on this 90 series do. 

Would Calmer choppers mount on the JD knife roll barrels or is it a another complete roll swap out like going from JD regular rolls to JD knife rolls ?

Also did you update the triple gear.

I know it's been argued endlessly about  the strength of newer triple gears vs older but I've changed 1 in the 693 due to a cracked gearbox (was undiscovered when I bought it and found while changing top sprockets) and have 5 more potential problems lurking.





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4WD
Posted 11/23/2015 08:48 (#4914558 - in reply to #4914448)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


NE part of SW Iowa

Von WC Ohio - 11/23/2015 07:53

You got any pics of the BT choppers and how they process stalks. Do they have the revolving window also ?

I've already got JD knife rolls which are pretty sharp yet but they just don't seem quite aggressive enough in sizing the stalks for my liking.  I actually think the knife roll conversion on my 40 series did a better job than those on this 90 series do. 

Would Calmer choppers mount on the JD knife roll barrels or is it a another complete roll swap out like going from JD regular rolls to JD knife rolls ?

Also did you update the triple gear.

I know it's been argued endlessly about  the strength of newer triple gears vs older but I've changed 1 in the 693 due to a cracked gearbox (was undiscovered when I bought it and found while changing top sprockets) and have 5 more potential problems lurking.

No, I haven't taken any photos, myself; but it does look just like other photos, of BT choppers, plus the bottom of the stalk(at root ball area) is exploded, too. {Someone mentioned that you need to try and keep right over corn rows (drive good), to make this happen, correctly}

Yes, they do have that revolving window.

On one row unit, I updated to triple gear, because I need to change the stalk roll shafts(bad roll pin hole), on that row anyway. Had no problems, with anything, involving snapping rolls, this year. {note: I did buy a complete spare row unit, from another member, just to have one, for quick replacement, should a failure happen)

This old 40 series cornhead, only uses 1 big roll pin, verses two on newer units= no problems , this year. (Note: newer shafts, that I installed, in that one gearbox, had two roll pin holes = so I used them)

Now, this year was different, because I waited for soybeans to dry down (late soybean planting) and got them out first, but to my surprise, that corn dried way, way quicker, than expected and the wettest load was 16.6% for the whole harvest, everything was dry. (10 days earlier, it was 21.6 with hand shelling, so if you add 2 points = 23.6% roughly) We normally start at 18-19%, because we pay for drying at elevator.

I drove really slow, and had good/great yields, but I wonder if I needed to speed up my rolls (I did try a back shaft speeds from 660 to 800 rpms) Normal is 680 rpms, in year past, with old rolls. The fastest I ever drove was 2.8 MPH, with the old 6620 sidehill combine; usually 2.4 mph. = I assume this helped process the stalks, too.

I remember one member mentioned, that he didn't feel BT choppers, did very good, with dry corn and stalks, and maybe I didn't see that issue, because I drove so slooooow.

This cornhead, got the slowdown gathering chain sprockets, last year(felt it did fine); but this year, I almost felt is was too slow, in getting the ears pulled up to auger (I did have most fields,at a little higher population, this year = might be exactly what I'm seeing)

 

I have plastic paddles, on 50% of gathering chain teeth, and thought about, going to 100%, next year. (cheap experiment)

 Might also, swap chain sprockets around, on the outer chain drives, to speed up cornhead gearboxes. (I'm just not sure I want the stalks getting pulled downward, so fast or faster, and causing possibly more head shelling)

This is a small farm, so going slow and taking an extra day or two, for corn harvest isn't a big deal. I'm more excited about next Spring and see how planting my 19" row soybeans, into this corn field debris/trash, will work. {=hope for less plugging with damp corn stalks, in early dewy mornings and late moist evenings}

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NEILFarmer
Posted 11/23/2015 09:11 (#4914592 - in reply to #4914558)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


Morris, IL
If you ever get time and get snow off them i'd be interested in what they look like now. Maybe you were lucky enough to miss this nice 2-3" snow we got Friday night/Saturday. Anyway i'm pretty happy with the B&R rolls but i've said before they are not calmers. They don't do quite the job but the big thing that bothers me is they allow so much residue into the machine. Did you notice an improvement on trash intake just changing the rolls Mike? Seems lot of guys say that calmer kit helps on trash intake, i have 2/3 the kit and notice no difference, my thinking is it takes the extra teeth on the rolls to do better job keeping a hold of the stalk on it's way down. The 6 flutes just like to break them off it seems, causes two problems, hard to float everything on straw walkers and causes a more fluffy look behind machine as cornhead pushes everything down where chopper tosses and it doesn't get even close to the ground.

Right now my fix for the high amount of trash intake is to slow down, better fix would be 9500 with the much increased walker area i think would really help. IF that happened i would update the cluster gear and cut a revolving window in the B&R i think.

Edited by NEILFarmer 11/23/2015 09:16
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Von WC Ohio
Posted 11/23/2015 11:50 (#4914813 - in reply to #4914558)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls



Same here very dry corn and lots of light fluffy fodder. Seems by about 2-3 pm I had 2 rows that would just float husks and fodder. Enough that it would soon block ears from feeding in. Stop shut down machine and you could easily kick the loose material into cross auger and be fine. Never had that light fluff issue before but seldom ever have that dry of corn and long open fall with no rains to dampen up stalks.

Usually run around 2.5 with 6 row also in good corn and back shaft speed at fastest which is about 690-710.

1st picture below is how my 4 row 443 with knife rolls and stompers on every row would usually have stalks looking by spring. Lots of visible dirt and no issues drilling beans into this with 750 drill. 2012 harvest and spring planting in 2013

Next 2 pictures (1st harvest) with 693 and stompers on every row seems more coverage on ground and wetter /muddier soils that don't dry out. 2013 harvest and 2014 planting.

I did not even take any pictures this spring of cornstalk mess but ended up planting 30" row beans for the first time since about 1998 since it was the only way to get the slot closed with the Dawn curvetines between the old corn rows. That turned out fine but the thick mat on the ground is why this fall I only ran stompers on the 2 rows the tires ran down to try and avoid this matting of material. I like the stompers to cut down on tire wear on the drill opener gauge wheels and transport tires but if it makes so much of a mat that stays wet then I can't use the drill anyhow.

Maybe I need to consider getting a disk and disking stalks in the fall to get some dirt exposed. Tend to run higher pops as well at around 33K.

 

2 important variables though. Last 2 winters have turned cold early with snow that has covered things up for majority of winter. Both of those winters were followed by very wet springs with excessive rains which aggravated the drying out issues. Previous to last 2 winters there has been little extended snow cover that lasted or extended cold. So did warmer winters with less cover and more rain than snow help break down the stalks ? Did being sealed up under snow cover stop the decomposition ?

Interesting discussion just wanting to avoid repeat of 2015 spring dealing with cornstalks so trying a few things differently.





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farmcorn
Posted 11/23/2015 15:35 (#4915104 - in reply to #4914813)
Subject: RE: chopping rolls


NCIL
Three year old Calmar rolls.



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4WD
Posted 11/23/2015 16:41 (#4915183 - in reply to #4914592)
Subject: Pictures for Ty and Von; BT chopper corn stalks


NE part of SW Iowa

This is after harvest and after about 3.5" of rain and 1.5" - 2.0" of snow. (32000 - 34000 pop on 38" rows)

 4 row cornhead, with NDY stalk stompers on all rows(pinned in middle hole) = notice how center rows pop back up, but drive tires smash outer 2 rows.

Edit: Grain moisture at 14 -16 % (DRY)



Edited by 4WD 11/23/2015 16:47




(BT Chopper corn stalks 004.jpg)



(BT Chopper corn stalks 007.jpg)



(BT Chopper corn stalks 008.jpg)



(BT Chopper corn stalks 009.jpg)



(BT Chopper corn stalks 012.jpg)



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Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 004.jpg (195KB - 103 downloads)
Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 007.jpg (188KB - 96 downloads)
Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 008.jpg (215KB - 110 downloads)
Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 009.jpg (199KB - 105 downloads)
Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 012.jpg (228KB - 94 downloads)
Attachments BT Chopper corn stalks 013.jpg (231KB - 106 downloads)
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NEILFarmer
Posted 11/23/2015 20:03 (#4915705 - in reply to #4915183)
Subject: RE: Pictures for Ty and Von; BT chopper corn stalks


Morris, IL
Thanks very much for the pictures Mike and Brian, looks like it's doing a darn good job. I've seen that with the corn stalks with stalk stompers around here Mike, we have never ran any but locals have, 6x30" rows fits nicely with 7720 with 30.5 tires. Tires are almost exactly 120" or 119.5" depends on condition of stalks but about 50% of the time it will lean stalk over, 50% of the time it won't. I've often though of trying a very thin spacer to try and get them both standing 95% of the time but kind of hate to cause more trouble then it's worth.

Do you notice difference in amount of residue getting pulled into the machine Mike?
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4WD
Posted 11/23/2015 20:59 (#4915891 - in reply to #4915705)
Subject: RE: Pictures for Ty and Von; BT chopper corn stalks


NE part of SW Iowa

About the amount of residue (into combine), I feel that these drier corn stalks, had a tendency to break off the top 1/4 of some of the dry plants, when I pushed the MPH more. It seems the snapping rolls weren't pulling them down as fast as last year{with slightly wetter corn (18-15.5 %)} BUT remember I increased population (in 38" rows = very close plants), so that has an effect to, for what my eyes are seeing.

It seems that the tops of the plant, were barely getting pulled down, completely, towards the top end of the snapping rolls. (I know that doesn't seem to make much sense, as one would presume that Calmer 10 flute snapping rolls should really pull quickly, on those stalks.

{Note: my plant spacing, was 4.9" at 34,000 in 38" rows, so that is comparable spacing to 43,000 plants in 30" rows = what I'm seeing may NOT relate to others, in 30" rows, with "normal" populations}

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NEILFarmer
Posted 11/23/2015 21:27 (#4915969 - in reply to #4915891)
Subject: RE: Pictures for Ty and Von; BT chopper corn stalks


Morris, IL
Thanks you, we plant a lot of 34k but 30" rows, lot of 200+ bushel corn and i find that residue you get from these newer, higher yielding hybrids is just crazy high. These old combines and cornheads built in the 80's were build for 150 bushel corn at 15% and 18% was considered wet. Now were averaging 1.5 yields 1.5x that, combining at 20-25%, with more plants you just can't set the hydro to 3mph and leave it their like in the past. I combined lot of corn at 2-2.5mph this year.

That is an interesting take on population, 43k in 30" rows is a lot of corn plants. You would be hard press to find anyone that plants that heavy in 30" rows, i think that is almost asking a lot of corn head to deal with that, looks like calmer is handing it pretty good.
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