|
|
south central IOWA | Why is the norm 60 days? Does that really make sense? Do some people not like giving a cow 3 chances to get bred? OR, is it more of a common practice to leave them in 65-70 days and just say 60 days?
Edited by play in the dirt 3/15/2011 23:28
|
|
| |
|
| 60 days for the cows. 75 for the heifers(let the bull out 2 weeks earlier with them) |
|
| |
|
WY, OK | Same here 60/75 give or take 2-3 days. 60 days exposure gives us close to 70 days of the cows calving and that is a huge difference between the calf that is 70 days older than the youngest @ weaning. 80%+ calve in 30 days so those last ones are killing your weights. |
|
| |
|
| I agree on tightening up your calving interval, but also those light calves can make you just as much money as the heavy calves. We pool our calves together, and sell a light contract. They mainly go to California and other warmer states for grass after the first of November. |
|
| |
|
Stratton, Ontario, Canada | The norm is due to pathetic and incompetent management. You should be aiming for 25-42 days. I know one local ranch that does 25 days on their 80 heifers between 2 bulls and those that are bred make the final cut.
If you want a 'longer' breeding season, it would be much more advantageous to do two 21-day exposures with a 21-day rest period in between them, to give you a 42 day season over 63 days. Tighten up the uniformity of age and size on your calves and it will pay dividends.
When people talk about leaving their bulls out with the cows 365 days, I think lazy hobby farmer who doesn't need to earn a premium and I can buy his calves to background through the winter at a dime or more discount. That is, assuming they have some kind of vaccination program. If not, it's at least a quarter discount, if I even bid at all.
This is coming from an operation that 20 years ago ran bulls 365 days, than 150, than 120, than 100, than 90, than 70, than 63, than 50, than 42 and last year was 30 days in the spring herd and 40 days in the fall herd. |
|
| |
|
New Mexico | problem with NOT pulling bulls for a while ( those who calf year around ) is ALOT more trich risk.
Trich is basically a vaginal protoza....dies ( starves itself ) out in cows with 60 to 70 days of no sexual activity.
Have had clients try the 42 to 45 day deal, I'm NOT sold on that.
Sure cleans up cows to the fertiles...but that 1st couple years is WOW for cull cow numbers.
Generally been 36 to 39% opens the 1st year of that program, 2nd year 18 to 20%.
3rd year will run 9 to 10%...should run 5% opens by the 4rth year.
Has been working cash wise due to incline of cull cow prices.
You've gotta be pretty adept at sourcing bred youngs to replace the culls to trade at Flush prices / costs though.
Just tend to think practical perhaps...better off to have some late pairs and sell those instead of open cull cows. MO.
Edited by Markwright 3/16/2011 01:04
|
|
| |
|
Casey IL. ( I -70 ) then south on rt.49 | I agree with Mark. I calve from March 1 - May1 anything after I cull. A lot of time after I wean a late calf and cow is breed back. I feel I get more out of my feed. If she is totally open she is history.
A breed cow around here sells better than an open cow and I do not mined having a later calf. I do not run but 30 head so no big deal. I am in it to make money and this works for me. As some one said lazey I guess but every one is set up deferant so do what works for you or me. |
|
| |
|
North Mo. | I am seriously thinking of leaving the bulls with cows except for Nov thru Ap calves. Right now we go from May to June and Sept thru Oct calving dates. The only thing I see wrong with this is I will pull my Sept cows into Aug calving. Think I just talked myself out of doing that. Ben |
|
| |
|
Driftless SW Wisconsin | I am looking for a very tight calving period. Like to have all calves born on first 23 day cycle and will cull any cows that have not calved within 45 days/2 cycles of the first calf. These "over 45 day" cows will get culled at weaning along with any cows that preg check open in November. I had no over 45 day females and no opens in my small herd last fall. However I put my bull in during early June and leave him in until weaning in November. this makes it easier to manage the rotational grazing, the bull is happier and less trouble. My bulls are in a separate field from the females from mid November until they go in with the cows and heifers in June. You can tighten up calving and maintain fertility in a couple different ways. I am using two bulls this year so instead of the bulls going in with the cows, I will be splitting the cows into two groups in separate fields to go in with each bull for 45-50 days then they will all go back into one group August 1 so they are easier to manage for rotational grazing. Jim at Dawn |
|
| |
|
| Bulls are in from July 4 till April 1 anything that calves after June 1st gets tagged and sold with her calf the next winter, we don't preg check. We have all but 2-3 cows calve in the 45 days from April 15-June 1, out of 60-70 cows. Done this for 30 years.
Edited by McFarmer 3/16/2011 08:58
|
|
| |
|
Your moms house | Ours go out from 5 - 15 till the 9-15 or so because we don't have any where for them dumb bastards to go and they're always wrecking stuff when there buy themselves. Yeah them June calver's don't amount to much so we sort them off and sell them to my landlord who finishes them out as freezer beef they grow just as good as everybody else just a little later. |
|
| |
|
south central IOWA | You say 60 days is basically 3 cycles but when at the mercy of mother nature so to speak (like you like to say) shouldn't a guy at least give all the cows a chance at 3 cycles if that is what they are trying do? Are people strict on the 60 days or do most run a few days over is what I'm looking for. |
|
| |
|
| I put bulls in to start calving the first of March, will be mostly all calved out by May 1. We leave bulls in cows till we bring cows off higher country, around middle Sept. No need to have them home tearing things up. We will preg. check main bunch of cows in Oct. All open cows will be pulled, either fed for markets to pick up or sold at that time. Never had over 10% old & open cows at preg. check time, usually a 50/50 deal. I will sometimes put bulls back out to graze alfalfa stubble pastures w/ confirmed bred cows in late fall. After preg. check, it will tell you if you had a trich. problem. But never with any open or unpreg. cows. Will then bring bulls back to ranch Trich. test in winter, at that time they are kept separate from any cows till spring turn out.
As far as yearling heifers, I bull them up two cycles with low birth weight bulls. Then they are turned with older cows. Then in Fall when preg. checking anything out of time frame will be tagged to be sold or tagged to be watched at calving. As of today this year, my heifers are at 75% calved out, 16 days into the first cycle. Why mess with A.I. when you can do that? Usually get 85% calves on first cycle for heifers, all finished by end of second cycle.
My comment about light calves in earlier post, might have been taken wrong. We run in real rough country, probably not as rough as some of MarkWright country. So the first calf heifers calves will sometimes come in 100 lighter than older cows calves. We group them together, sell light grass contracts. When you can sell 460 wt. steers for $1.46, why do I need to press for a 550 wt. calf? Usually market bigger steers at 580 wts. and 650 wts. to 700 wts. for cows that run in better higher mountain pastures.
Granted pounds always sell, you need to maximize returns. That's why we pool calves and sell light & heavy contracts. We don't sell just one weight w/slide. As MarkWright will tell you, these ranches out west running on desert country can be very profitable. Yes, they sell light calves but they run cows cheap. Your net return is far greater than a cow having to be fed 6-7 months out of the year on hay. It's not what you make on calves, it's what you put in your pocket after it's all said and done. |
|
| |
|
New Mexico | just leave em with the cows till fall...then sort bulls off to their own winter pasture.
Also more folks here calf in April / May than early.
|
|
| |
|
Driftless SW Wisconsin | I like your approach of tagging and selling any pairs that are out of your time slot for calving. However if you don't preg check how do you know the ones that are open until they dont have a calf next spring? Then you've paid to feed them all winter and have no output from that cow for a year.... Jim at Dawn |
|
| |
|
| I'd rather have a late calf than an open cow. Will generally have bull exposure from June 1 till cows come off pasture, maybe I'm lazy. I still recall a neighbor selling calves in March, had a potload of 700 # steers bring $20/head less than 19 head of 570#. |
|
| |
|
North Cental Mo. | That is what I do most of the time, I can think of one guy locally that pulls his at about 75 days, the rest do it in the fall..
Roy |
|
| |
|
| And she's bigger and the market is usually better. |
|
| |
|
Central, IA | I turn in bulls end of May and don't take them out until the next January or February. I let them with the cows to run stalks in the winter and don't have to worry about a seperate pen for them but only a couple months out of the year (Feb thru May) I guess that I am really lazy........ But I feel I can defend myself on that. We preg check all cows in November, anything that is open gets sold, and anything that pregs "late" gets looked at close whether she is kept or not. I still can run a 60 to 75 day calving window this way. Start calving March 1st. When May X rolls around and I do not have a calf on the ground when they go out to pasture....Cow ether gets sold as a P3 bred, or kept in the lot if she is showing and sold as a pair when the calf comes.
I don't think that it is a matter of how long you run your bulls. It is a matter of if you preg check, and what you say your end calving date is going to be. |
|
| |
|
south central IOWA | Don't feel bad, I'll join the really lazy group. The way I look at it is the bulls don't seem to get as grumpy only being away from the cows for 3 months and on a mature bull you can easily give him grain for 3 months to get him back in ideal condition for turn out. Otherwise knowing my luck I'd get him too fat and he'd be a bump on a log come turn out and then I'd be up the creek............
|
|
| |
|
Central, IA | That is part of the reason we leave them with the cows for that long. I think they are more docile when with the ladies, Our cows are on the stalks in the winter, but they also get really good alfalfa hay as well. So I don't see much condition loss on the bulls, and I still have enough time to grain them if needed before the next calving season.
I will say it is sometimes a pain haying cows with 3 bulls with them. But you just have to respect them and no where they are at. No different then calving cows in barns / lots, just need some common sense. |
|
| |
|
Iowa | 60 to 75 days here just depends on when we can get them out. I hate having late calves, so much going on in the summer to always be looking out for new calves. Been my luck to have a late born end up dead. Plus late cows are hard to bread back. Seems 2 out of the last 5 dont bread back. All my pastures border other pastures so it gets hard to keep bulls in once his cows are taken care of. Bull pasture is away from other pastures. Preg checking is a must, you can find problems earily, and save a lot in feed. Plus I need places to put younger cows so dont really have room to wait and see if a cow is open or just late. |
|
| |
How long do you leave your bulls in?
