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jodan

Posted 2/5/2016 18:58 (#5090795)
Subject: Need advice on dog training

Bardstown, Ky

I have an Australian shepherd that I would like to get to help with moving the cattle. He is 2 1/2 years old and seems to have an abundance of the herding instinct. He tries to keep anything that moves in a group, cats, kids, other dogs, he is always circling, keeping them bunched up. I need to know how to get him to move the cattle without me at his side. For instance, when we move calves from the working area back to their feeding barn, he will stay beside me, but I have to move the calves myself, with him at my side. How do I get him to move them on to the barn without me. He wants to work but I can't figure out how to show him what I want. Please advise, thanks!

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Supa Dexta

Posted 2/5/2016 19:23 (#5090862 - in reply to #5090795)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

NS Canada

Start small, try putting 2 or 3 animals from one place into another, Work them one way, and then another. And encourage and reward him when he does what you want. Work by his side to start, even with a leash perhaps and then build from there. Talk to him as you're doing it.

jodan

Posted 2/5/2016 19:32 (#5090881 - in reply to #5090862)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

Bardstown, Ky

He has learned to stay by my side and not try to run the calves himself, perhaps too well. Now I don't know how to teach him that I want him take the calves on without me.

Haleiwa

Posted 2/5/2016 20:34 (#5091018 - in reply to #5090795)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

West Chazy, New York

Can you have him work beside someone else's trained dog?

jodan

Posted 2/5/2016 20:47 (#5091046 - in reply to #5091018)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

Bardstown, Ky

I wish I could but I don't know anyone who has one.

denice.r

Posted 2/6/2016 05:23 (#5091436 - in reply to #5091046)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

south east Indiana

Jordan

Without seeing him it is hard for me to give you advice. IF he is an Aussie they generally like to push but are not dogs who generally work in large spaces or far from you. If he is circling and keeping them bunched that is the first stage. Then teach him to stop on command and give names to the directions he is going around stock - come bye and away to me are tradition. If you use Come to call him you can not use come bye to go clockwise so use go bye.

When I start driving with my dogs we begin by walking together to build their confidence. When they begin to understand I drift back and further out to the side to allow them to feel that pressure and feel in charge. Confidence is huge, they have to believe they can do it and you will help if they need it.

Come on up if you want some pointers. Having a clinic the 15,16,17 of April here.

jodan

Posted 2/6/2016 06:31 (#5091475 - in reply to #5091436)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

Bardstown, Ky

Denise , I was hoping you would chime in! Thanks for the advice, I guess maybe I just need to be patient. It's amazing how his attitude has changed in the last few months. He has always wanted to work with the cattle but when the time came, and we were actually in direct contact with the cattle (no fence or anything between us and the cattle) he seemed afraid. That fear seems to be going away. I guess that is the confidence you are speaking of. Thanks again!

Howdyjabo

Posted 2/6/2016 12:33 (#5092244 - in reply to #5091475)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

Patience

Go do the same daily job with him. Take cattle from here and put them there. Doesn't really matter if you do it or he does it. Bring a long stick with you and swing it around some(gently and not at the dog- desensitization). Make a big deal over the dog when the gate shuts.

When he gets confident with that use your stick(as an extension of your arm-- NOT a weapon) to ease him away from your leg and you take one side and let him work (or follow) the other. GO SLOW just ask for a foot of space at a time. And only ask for more space when the cattle and you are moving. If you see him stressing when he stays away from you for too long just let him drift back closer. Over and over and over....... building confidence is the goal. If you can, start trying to send him away (with the stick) when the cattle turn so he has a reason to go away from you to catch them.

denice.r

Posted 2/6/2016 16:33 (#5092669 - in reply to #5091475)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

south east Indiana

Jordan not unusual for a dog to be concerned. Especially so if we have worked for the last __ months on keeping him out of cattle and now all of sudden want him to help. Alot of barking and running up to fence is due to concern/fear/ being unsure. Many people think it is them being protective - not usually the case. I start taking my pups to stock as soon as they start wanting to go. I teach them an excellent call off first in the house, then yard then on stock in a small space so I can enforce the recall. Once I have that we are ready to work. Before they are wanting to work I teach the pups to stay with me out in the pasture, hopefully before instincts are kicked in telling them something different.

Aussies enjoy driving so that is where I would start, first on say a 20 ft line with calves as small as possible- no Pairs - then gradually increase the distance you are away from the dog. First next to, then off to both sides and then off to the sides and behind a bit. Help push cattle if she hesitates, she will figure it out. My walk up command is "Walk up" You can ask for a stop, I prefer a stand on cattle since they can get out the way faster if need be. SHe should ALWAYS be watching the cattle not you> So no hand signals, if she is watching you she is not paying attention to the cattle. Do not call her BACK to you so that she is turning her butt to the stock and giving ground - 1 the cattle feel they win, 2 they can take advantage of that. When you call her off make sure you are to the side and at least to her shoulder or a step or two ahead of her shoulder. That way she leaves cattle and can still see and feel them. Never call her off with cattle facing her. Always if possible have her stand her ground till you get up there to help her turn their heads away from her and move off. This will help her gain confidence and let her know she can count on you. I always try to put the dog in training in a situation where it can WIN. If the dog looses or gets worried and leaves of backs off you have to encourage her to keep going till she wins. Sometimes not possible but that is why I start in a smaller area with a few stock unless I have an older dog capable of being the back up.

Tone is huge so listen to yourself when asking her things or working with her. Sometimes you have to let them get a bit overzealous and super keen to build confidence then you use little corrections to keep control
Hope that helps/ bring her up sometime

jodan

Posted 2/7/2016 07:33 (#5093637 - in reply to #5092669)
Subject: RE: Need advice on dog training

Bardstown, Ky

Thanks for the advice guys! I will just keep on, keeping on, and be patient.

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