AgTalk Home
AgTalk Home
Search Forums | Classifieds (47) | Skins | Language
You are logged in as a guest. ( logon | register )

160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent
View previous thread :: View next thread
   Forums List -> Crop TalkMessage format
 
ZF1986
Posted 12/15/2015 19:54 (#4962521)
Subject: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


South Dakota
What would you figure you could offer for rent on land with an aph of close to 170? Just curious what Guys are thinking right now thanks
Top of the page Bottom of the page
bpreuss
Posted 12/15/2015 20:00 (#4962551 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


MN
160
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Hilltop Husker
Posted 12/15/2015 20:10 (#4962599 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Northern Nebraska
Dryland rent is being propped up by crp bids. 250+ I know a couple guys who gave up ground that is going to be ten year stuff next spring.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/15/2015 22:02 (#4963069 - in reply to #4962599)
Subject: No kidding!!


EC Nebraska
Hilltop Husker - 12/15/2015 20:10

Dryland rent is being propped up by crp bids. 250+ I know a couple guys who gave up ground that is going to be ten year stuff next spring.



Yeah. I've got ground with an APH around 125. I asked at the FSA today, it would be $213/acre for 10-15 years. This is an enhancement program, so there's no ranking. If I wanted in then sign the papers right now. $150/acre one time signing bonus in addition to the yearly rent.

I don't think I'll go for it, I'm a grain farmer, not a gov'ment farmer. But it sure is tempting.

Top of the page Bottom of the page
pfl
Posted 12/16/2015 09:10 (#4963800 - in reply to #4963069)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


Hillsdale Michigan
with this stupid CRP program and the Government playing renter we all are screwed! big time, we have $80-100 land here that they are paying $150 and up, this land will avg 80-130 bu corn depends on the year and how much water we get and when
when will this craziness stop?.......this is in part to the high corn prices, and the greed of some who have to farm it all. rents will not go down at all,we are in for some tough times
Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/16/2015 13:18 (#4964302 - in reply to #4963800)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


EC Nebraska
pfl - 12/16/2015 09:10

with this stupid CRP program and the Government playing renter we all are screwed! big time, we have $80-100 land here that they are paying $150 and up, this land will avg 80-130 bu corn depends on the year and how much water we get and when
when will this craziness stop?.......this is in part to the high corn prices, and the greed of some who have to farm it all. rents will not go down at all,we are in for some tough times


Yeah, it's ridiculous. That ground isn't worth $213 rent. I only paid $1,200/acre for it to begin with. If we're looking at very many years of sub $3.50 corn, I'd be better off putting it in.

Top of the page Bottom of the page
IH884
Posted 12/16/2015 12:38 (#4964191 - in reply to #4963069)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


Central Alberta
What I have learned is that if you don't take the governments money and waste it the competition will. Get it signed up. Government is not getting out of the economy any time soon.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/16/2015 13:26 (#4964321 - in reply to #4964191)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


EC Nebraska
IH884 - 12/16/2015 12:38

What I have learned is that if you don't take the governments money and waste it the competition will. Get it signed up. Government is not getting out of the economy any time soon.


My biggest objection to this program is how it's operated. It's a "wetland restoration program" They say the wet land plants will come back naturally, so don't do anything with it. No seeding of desirable species, just let the weeds grow. I've got a tough time stomaching that. I'd be allowed to shred it twice a year, but that'll only do so much. It's still going to look like hell for at least two years past the program expiration.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
johnwayne360
Posted 12/17/2015 16:01 (#4967143 - in reply to #4964321)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


near dyersville iowa
so if its wetlands when the contract is up..then can you even farm it again? or what will be the rules when it comes out?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/17/2015 16:14 (#4967174 - in reply to #4967143)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


EC Nebraska
johnwayne360 - 12/17/2015 16:01

so if its wetlands when the contract is up..then can you even farm it again? or what will be the rules when it comes out?


It's considered "farmable wetlands" now. I should be able to burn it down and farm it again as long as I don't move any dirt or try to drain it in any way. It will probably take a couple years to get the weeds under control after the contract is up. No profit those years.

It's possible that it would be a little better soil structure then it is now but it will certainly have a much larger weed seed bank than it does now. It really depends on the weather during those years. We've been in wet cycle since 2006, it's very possible we'd revert to a dry cycle and that ground would be bare and blowing. That would be a disaster.

Biggest question to me is what are grain prices going to do during that ten years. If it's going to be below $3.20 most of the time, then it's going to be hard to beat the CRP income. If corn is above $3.50 more often than not, I can probably beat that. If there's a 25% chance I can make more money NOT putting it into CRP, than I'm not going to. But it would be kinda good to have it in if we've got sub-$3.00 corn half of those years.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
johnwayne360
Posted 12/17/2015 16:21 (#4967188 - in reply to #4967174)
Subject: RE: No kidding!!


near dyersville iowa
ok. i dont farm any wetlands, so wasnt sure what the rules would be. As long as you can farm it when it comes out, its worth consideration. Im actually contemplating taking payments for buffer strips that would take most of my pasture. $85/acre was the last quote I got. but i dont know if im ready to get rid of the cows.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
JohnDeereGreenWKY
Posted 12/15/2015 20:25 (#4962660 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


West Ky
225 here
Top of the page Bottom of the page
ILCORNGROWER
Posted 12/15/2015 20:28 (#4962676 - in reply to #4962660)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Northern Illinois
Whats it worth. Probably about 175. What would it bring. 300.

Edited by ILCORNGROWER 12/15/2015 20:28
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Olivermaddness
Posted 12/15/2015 20:29 (#4962679 - in reply to #4962676)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Western Wisconsin
$160 FLEX rent....good luck though ha
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Survivor
Posted 12/15/2015 20:46 (#4962750 - in reply to #4962679)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Moreauville LA
Why?

Is there some kind of ego trip going on to prove " I can farm it for that and come out?" I know something you don't know.

Is there some kind of pride deal to not drop or refuse to pay high rent for ground that doesn't pencil, and hold on for when things get better?

If anyone has a way to make $225 rent work on 170 bu corn, I'd like to hear it.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
paul the original
Posted 12/15/2015 21:55 (#4963045 - in reply to #4962750)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


southern MN
Its a funny thing.

Neighbors - some, not all - have been saying for years, the monitor never drops below 200 on their yield monitor, was another good year....

This past year we have had the big one - best weather we've had in many decades.

Same neighbors are talking about seeing 250 on the monitor, and whole fields bringing 195.....



But, but, but - I thought their monitor never went below 200 previous years?

Huh.

Anyhow, I'd guess 150-180 is an honest assessment of actual, whole farm corn yields. We get a lot of corn fields with a circle of poor late planted beans in it where the corn drowned out more years than not.... So,ehow those circles never get averaged in.....


Anyhow, I'd guess rent is in the 225 to 300 buck range here. Probably the lower side to long relationships, and the higher side to landowners not living local, or wanting top dollar doesn't matter how things get done. And yes, there is lower and higher rents too.

I don't know how the 300 stuff works. Not sure how the 225 works if we get prices like expected and back to normal yields.

Paul
Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/16/2015 07:29 (#4963570 - in reply to #4962750)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

go organic, plant org food grade corn get $14 / bu picked up on farm, ave 140- 150 bpa, plant  clear hilum sb get $29/ bu picked up, get 40 bpa, not too hard to do math!  That's how we can all do it , even me !

Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/16/2015 12:07 (#4964128 - in reply to #4963570)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


EC Nebraska
eastgrove - 12/16/2015 07:29

go organic, plant org food grade corn get $14 / bu picked up on farm, ave 140- 150 bpa, plant  clear hilum sb get $29/ bu picked up, get 40 bpa, not too hard to do math!  That's how we can all do it , even me !



How often do you have those crops in the rotation? It's the rest of the rotation that messes up the math.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/16/2015 15:02 (#4964480 - in reply to #4964128)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

organic 3 year rotation, other year is wheat, oats, or rye, wheat 60bpa@$12.50/bu picked up=$750, oats 100bpa@$6.50/bu pu=$650, rye 45bpa@$12/bu =$ 540.
Math still works for me!
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
cornstalk
Posted 12/16/2015 16:44 (#4964629 - in reply to #4964480)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



Anderson County Kansas
If it were that easy everyone would be doing it and organic wouldn't be worth nearly as much. Several guys around here have tried it, they all either quit and went back conventional, or they went broke.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/16/2015 17:02 (#4964671 - in reply to #4964629)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

sorry to hear about someones bad experience,
i have been certified organic for 8 years, yields are going up and system is working for me, I "survived' 1st year certified with "only $6 corn,100bpa, sold wheat at commodity non organic price, and made money.
yes it is more work and takes more management but the peace of mind and as you can see by the "math" the financial awards are making it possible for me to full time farm 480 acres and do well.
Even if "everyone " got in to organic, i could still make it at lower price / bu.
but don't think we have to worry about that with the reluctance of farmers to raise organic here!
Kinda ironic since "everyone" farmed organic 60  or so years ago, and made it! 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/17/2015 16:51 (#4967264 - in reply to #4964671)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

eastgrove - 12/16/2015 17:02

sorry to hear about someones bad experience,
i have been certified organic for 8 years, yields are going up and system is working for me, I "survived' 1st year certified with "only $6 corn,100bpa, sold wheat at commodity non organic price, and made money.
yes it is more work and takes more management but the peace of mind and as you can see by the "math" the financial awards are making it possible for me to full time farm 480 acres and do well.
Even if "everyone " got in to organic, i could still make it at lower price / bu.
but don't think we have to worry about that with the reluctance of farmers to raise organic here!
Kinda ironic since "everyone" farmed organic 60  or so years ago, and made it! 


I would rather encourage my fellow US farmer to go organic then see 40% go to foreign countries like it is now, As I stated before it doesn't seem like much of a chance of that happening, and even if premiums drop in half I would still be satisfied  and profitable.
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/17/2015 18:38 (#4967535 - in reply to #4967264)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


EC Nebraska
You said you have sandy soils. I'm guessing you don't have go week after week of unable to drive across your fields in the spring. That is reality for me. I get a couple days to drive on some fields per spring and that's it until the crop and weeds are too tall to work.

Organic is fine where it works. I'm glad it works for you. It doesn't work as well here. (by a year of covers/ green manure I meant an entire year devoted to weed control and nitrogen fixation. No cash crops of any kind)

I've sent samples of my grain in for feed testing, just to see how nutritious it is. They've come back with mineral and nutrient levels way above the standards used for ration formulation. So I think I'm producing high quality grain in an environmentally responsible manner. (erosion is pretty well under control on my ground and soil OM is slowly increasing while fertilizer use per bushel of grain is decreasing). And then I read the organic marketing campaign which promotes itself by saying I'm producing "nutritionally empty grain that destroys the environment." It's a pack of lies. Do you understand how it might rankle a bit?

Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/17/2015 23:00 (#4968460 - in reply to #4967535)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

sounds like you are working the right way , keep at it.  Cover crops and manure , and getting the biology working again is what really helped me out. 
I would rather tell the positives of organics than label chemical farming practices as bad.  It is a journey, we were conservation farmers of the year for our county back in 1995, 100% no-till and chemical all the way .  I got to seeing some of the work Practical Farmers of Iowa was doing and it made sense, and slowly keep reading and following up on stuff and made the jump to organic 100% 10 yr ago.  The system works , but takes time and effort to make it fit each specific operation, glad I did it , and see all the benefits to soil, plants , insects, my heath,( no more headaches form using insecticides in planter in the spring).  Also see how organics and more farmers would boost our small rural town communities and economy.  Again I'm trying not to go negative on chemical farming , just trying to show the benefits of an organic system and that it can and does work.
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
KLo
Posted 12/18/2015 07:39 (#4968817 - in reply to #4968460)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



Northeast, NE
eastgrove could you email me? I have a few questions for you.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
NE Ridger
Posted 12/16/2015 23:20 (#4965827 - in reply to #4964480)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


EC Nebraska
eastgrove - 12/16/2015 15:02

organic 3 year rotation, other year is wheat, oats, or rye, wheat 60bpa@$12.50/bu picked up=$750, oats 100bpa@$6.50/bu pu=$650, rye 45bpa@$12/bu =$ 540.
Math still works for me!
thanks 



I can't raise that high a wheat yield reliably even with a fungicide spraying here. Rusts eat the small grains. I've grown wheat and oats before. I may someday try rye for my own cover seed. But I won't try them again without planned fungicides.
There's a reason that an old poster used to say that in Nebraska an organic rotation should consist of corn, beans, covers/green manure. I'm really not sure that's enough to break weed cycles, but it might be. However, you're only selling grain 2/3 of the time. And you won't get the yields on my basin ground because you can't do timely tillage. So. . .

Organic works well in certain climates and soil types. Not in all of them.

ETA: Yes, everyone farmed mostly organic 70 years ago. They raped the soils in so doing. I'll never see ground as good as what my grandfather started with. His plowing and stubble raking burned through the rich organic matter of the prairie sod. They simply didn't have the knowledge or equipment to care for the ground as we can today, but I'll pay the price of their "success" all my life.
You're not destroying soil like they did then, and you can afford to replace the nutrients that they simply depleted. But don't pretend that we could all farm today like they did then and survive. My Grandfather said many times that "the only 'good' about the 'good old days' is that they were old and that we don't live in them anymore."



Edited by NE Ridger 12/16/2015 23:29
Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/17/2015 07:42 (#4966124 - in reply to #4965827)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

yes i agree cover crops are essential, for brevity i didn't include my cover rotation, after corn harvest otill drill rye, sb follow in spring,  on sb after harvest either plant otill drill rye or winter wheat, or let set idle and plant oats next spring, on small grains frost seed with spreader on frozen ground med red clover, or after harvest drill hairey vetch and radish.
Yes I agree we shouldn't farm the same practices that destroyed soils 60 yr ago, we can utilize soil saving practices and still be organic, I know since I am doing it along with many others in different regions .
As far as "good old days" , life is what you make it I can either look at life for the positive or I can dwell on the negative.  Adversity builds character! We have a lot of characters in my area since we have sandy rough ground ! They have developed patience , a very good work ethic, usually have a great faith life, would give you the shirt off their back for you.  Think about the sense of community they had back then!  I see that same sense of community and ethics in the organic farming communities I am familiar with.  To me organic farming is a way of life , not just a farming practice.
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
Mikenesd
Posted 12/17/2015 13:49 (#4966931 - in reply to #4963570)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Clark SD

eastgrove - 12/16/2015 06:29

go organic, plant org food grade corn get $14 / bu picked up on farm, ave 140- 150 bpa, plant  clear hilum sb get $29/ bu picked up, get 40 bpa, not too hard to do math!  That's how we can all do it , even me !


 Just wondering, can you get them prices right away, or do you have wait untill the transition period is over?

Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/17/2015 15:54 (#4967130 - in reply to #4966931)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

those are prices you can get now, transition period is 3 years from last applied prohibited substance, you can sometimes get transition done in 2.5 years if you time it right.  Sometimes can get a Non gmo transition premium but you really have to look to get it. FSA sometimes has help for transitioning farms with cover crops.
Encourage you to keep looking at it!
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
cornstalk
Posted 12/17/2015 15:57 (#4967140 - in reply to #4967130)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



Anderson County Kansas
I guess I don't see why you would need to encourage anybody to keep looking at it. If its as great as you make it sound, you will have plenty of company. Then guess what? The premiums won't be near what they are now.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Mikenesd
Posted 12/17/2015 19:28 (#4967756 - in reply to #4967130)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Clark SD

eastgrove - 12/17/2015 14:54

those are prices you can get now, transition period is 3 years from last applied prohibited substance, you can sometimes get transition done in 2.5 years if you time it right.  Sometimes can get a Non gmo transition premium but you really have to look to get it. FSA sometimes has help for transitioning farms with cover crops.
Encourage you to keep looking at it!
thanks 


 I want to make sure we are both on the same page. Can the prices you showed be for uncertifed organic grains or must they be certified organic to get those price's?

Top of the page Bottom of the page
eastgrove
Posted 12/17/2015 23:07 (#4968469 - in reply to #4967756)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


N C ILL

the prices I used were actual prices for this fall for certified organic crops,
I have only heard  $.50 / bu corn premium for nongmo, and maybe $2/ bu sb nongmo.
A good strategy is if you can use hay, to put transitioning ground into hay for the 2.5 years and then into corn for first year certified organic .  There are other rotations and market possibilities, keep looking and ask around in organic circles.  Keep looking.
thanks 

Top of the page Bottom of the page
chadlit
Posted 12/15/2015 20:49 (#4962763 - in reply to #4962679)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



SD
It all depends on your cost of production and your ability to assume risk aS im sure you know. 170 aph corn is pretty good. Is the spring guarantee price going to be .... $3.75? @ 85% you are only looking at $540 guarantee. Unless you can piggy back another crop insurance program to get a higher revenue guarantee anything over $160 looks pretty risky to me.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/15/2015 20:53 (#4962788 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
Some pretty good ground went for 235 an acre on a 3 year deal here today. 200 plus acres. I hope it works for him.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
KLo
Posted 12/15/2015 20:57 (#4962808 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



Northeast, NE
Flex rent at $1.20/bu on corn and $4.20/bu on beans. That is about as high as I would go.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Cliff SEIA
Posted 12/15/2015 21:02 (#4962831 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


That would be typical ground for this area and you won't rent much for under $200 and $225+ will be way more common.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/15/2015 21:16 (#4962875 - in reply to #4962831)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
The ground I metioned is good for this area. 150-200 BPA at best. We also historically have some of the worst basis levels in the country.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
zmracing
Posted 12/15/2015 21:25 (#4962917 - in reply to #4962831)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


west central MN

In our area we are probable giving up $80 to $90 an acre of income on the basis compared to were you farm. I think that farmers around me hear what rent is going for in areas with similar yields and forget how much difference the basis can actually make. $225+ an acre in your area is probable a better deal then $160 in our area.



Edited by zmracing 12/15/2015 21:48
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/15/2015 21:35 (#4962955 - in reply to #4962917)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
With all due respect I'm in east north east south dakota. About 25 miles from the mn border. Probably not that far from you. Watertown sd area. Probably not much difference in basis. Watertown elevator and Benson mn elevator appear to be similar bids. I agree with you 100% if you were responding to cliff in se iowa.

Edited by redrover 12/15/2015 21:45
Top of the page Bottom of the page
zmracing
Posted 12/15/2015 21:45 (#4962993 - in reply to #4962955)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


west central MN

I did see where you are from and I think it is going to be pretty hard for anyone to make much money on $235.00 an acre rent in our areas. I was responding to Clay and his post about what rent is going for in his area.



Edited by zmracing 12/15/2015 21:49
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/15/2015 21:47 (#4963005 - in reply to #4962993)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
My bad, you are absolutely correct.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
mn2
Posted 12/16/2015 07:21 (#4963561 - in reply to #4962955)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


redrover - 12/15/2015 21:35

With all due respect I'm in east north east south dakota. About 25 miles from the mn border. Probably not that far from you. Watertown sd area. Probably not much difference in basis. Watertown elevator and Benson mn elevator appear to be similar bids. I agree with you 100% if you were responding to cliff in se iowa.
any idea what that land rented for south of Goodwin sd think it was around 235 acres.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/16/2015 12:17 (#4964147 - in reply to #4963561)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
235 per acre
Top of the page Bottom of the page
mn2
Posted 12/16/2015 12:23 (#4964157 - in reply to #4964147)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


redrover - 12/16/2015 12:17

235 per acre
was it decen't gound
Top of the page Bottom of the page
redrover
Posted 12/16/2015 12:29 (#4964168 - in reply to #4964157)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NESD
Good ground for this part of the world.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
haybstr67
Posted 12/16/2015 05:15 (#4963414 - in reply to #4962917)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NE SD
Around here be lucky to get it for $225-250. Crazy. $100 too high I think. Like you say, basis up here stinks and I'd much rather try to do it in Iowa! Plus, we've had good crops lately but truly think we are more likely to fail due to dry weather than they are down south. I've seen it too many times in our neighborhood!
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Cat33
Posted 12/15/2015 21:49 (#4963014 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


NE SD
Around here you'd have to start at 200 just to be in the conversation.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Trapshooter1
Posted 12/15/2015 22:58 (#4963232 - in reply to #4963014)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Grandpa calls it God's country, NEIA
Honestly I know of some farms. That are still in the 375-400 range for the next couple years. There is no way in hell that is going to work. My feeling is that their holding onto it knowing if they let it go they'll never get a chance to get it back.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
hobby95
Posted 12/16/2015 00:07 (#4963333 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


SW MINNESOTA
Heard a about a deal from seed corn salesman about 1800 acres went up for sealed bids. Landlord actually threw out anything over 280 figuring no way that pencils out without mining the land. Apparently went for around 240. I believe he said it was in Marshal mn area but also have no idea if it's true story or not.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
IADAVE
Posted 12/16/2015 00:19 (#4963342 - in reply to #4963333)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Some rented for $300 not far from here. My pencil says they have to either cut expenses $150 an acre over this year or have $150 more income over this falls prices to break even.
I have talked to several guys who pay up to get the ground. They figure on the landlord bragging about the big rent. Then when they go back to him and pay a lesser amount he will take it and not tell any one.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
PeteMN
Posted 12/16/2015 00:58 (#4963360 - in reply to #4963342)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


E.Central MN
Wow, sounds like what some of the big renters did around here about 10-15 years back. The landlords were bragging about how much rent the guy was going to pay and we had a wet spring, the renter only paid rent on the ground he got planted (about half of it). Have heard of a few situations years back where the renter offered high rents, planted and harvested a crop but didn't pay anything and the landlord let them run it another year hoping that the renter would make enough money to pay both years rent...the renter told the landlord he didn't make anything the second year either. Its no wonder some guys can offer to pay higher rents than anybody else in the area.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
ndsu84
Posted 12/16/2015 05:19 (#4963417 - in reply to #4963360)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


EC North Dakota
Why would a landlord not require 100% in February?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Dave9110
Posted 12/16/2015 05:52 (#4963440 - in reply to #4963417)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



north-central Indiana west of Fulton
I'm going to require the grain terminal where we sell our grain at least half advance on corn and beans in February too.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
twraska
Posted 12/16/2015 08:29 (#4963689 - in reply to #4963440)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Wallis, TX

Here it is standard practice to pay cash rents in the spring for the coming year.

Top of the page Bottom of the page
Dave9110
Posted 12/16/2015 09:02 (#4963777 - in reply to #4963689)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



north-central Indiana west of Fulton
Maybe.... but doesn't make it right in my opinion when it could be 12 months before you have income from those acres. Just pointing out the silliness of some of the cash rent agreement farmers are making to farm more acres. Would you pay for a tractor a year before it is delivered ? Pay your electric bill before you use any electricity ? I could go on .
Top of the page Bottom of the page
pfl
Posted 12/16/2015 09:14 (#4963806 - in reply to #4963777)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Hillsdale Michigan
you are right ,but common sense has left the building so to say, and thanks to the greed of a few, this isn't going to end well
Top of the page Bottom of the page
puma
Posted 12/16/2015 10:17 (#4963910 - in reply to #4963777)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


It was also the silly farmer who didn't pay the second half that caused the landlords to require it all up front.

You are very fortunate to be able to bring several next generation farmers to your operation without having to expand.

What would you do if your landlord decided he wants it all up front?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Dave9110
Posted 12/16/2015 10:53 (#4963971 - in reply to #4963910)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



north-central Indiana west of Fulton
The landlord has some responsibility in who he rents to. If he went with a tenant that was paying more than he should then I don't feel too sorry for him . Obviously local reputation is important. It he chose to rent for pie in the sky $ from a farmer from who knows where, which is common now days than the landlord has to accept the risk. Expansion of acres doesn't mean more income if you loose money on the new acres. Many of these numbers simply don't show that you will make money on them.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
puma
Posted 12/16/2015 12:37 (#4964188 - in reply to #4963971)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


I completely agree, but when landlords hear of others being shorted, then they take care of the risk by getting all of the rent up front, high rent or not. Just like you help mitigate risk of farming by buying crop insurance, the landlord is doing the same thing.

You seem to think that only the people that got hurt in the past will ask for it all up front.

Has it ever been obvious that a person should be expanding at the current times, or has it always been a hindsight is 20/20?

In 1996, there was no margin in farming, expansion was pointless, in 2003 there was no margin, in 2012 things were out of whack, with margin, now we are back to no margin.

It appears that we are in a business where there never is a margin that warrants expansion at the time, but in hindsight things worked in 96', 03', and even 12'.

Maybe things aren't that terrible now, it just takes a sharp pencil, or out of the box thinking?

This may sound like a jab, it isn't, I am just trying to figure out what the right thing to do in the future is, basing it off of historical knowledge.

A person walk away from my rented ground, or they won't have ground to farm (if they don't own it all), but if they can't make money farming, that doesn't work; what is the right answer?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Dave9110
Posted 12/16/2015 13:08 (#4964271 - in reply to #4964188)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



north-central Indiana west of Fulton
Your right, it is hard to have the right answer. The original poster was referring to ground he was thinking of making an offer on, not something he already farmed . If you make an offer that is a money looser now, you will probably never make any money on it because if prices rebound the landlord will just expect more or get the next guy that will farm it for nothing. If you already are farming it, maybe you can hold on and expect the rent to remain the same when prices improve. Senseless to me to keep kicking the can down the road for a future profit that will be pulled out from under you before you get it. Good landlord relationships are a must and rather hard to come by these days. Renters are showing up from 50 miles away.....brought in by farm management companies landlords have signed up their land to. Can't compete with that, and no point.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
puma
Posted 12/16/2015 13:42 (#4964344 - in reply to #4964271)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


That's the exact argument a person could use for a young person to never start. I don't believe that the answer is just roll over and give up.


The reason why I questioned how your young people were able to come back. I believe I am about the same age as them. I wasn't going to take a paycheck from dad, as that would be an unsupportable detriment to his operation, but we have worked together with machinery as I take on ground, gaining some efficiencies there.

I wouldn't be farming if he said don't do it, that won't work.

Was there room on your operation or was expansion required for them to come back?

Just trying to understand all points of view.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
garvo
Posted 12/16/2015 06:20 (#4963464 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


western iowa,by Denison
50 bushel dec corn 1/2 your basis
corn is close to $4-less 1/2 your basis-probably $.20 so $3.80 x 50= $190 acre
Top of the page Bottom of the page
ZF1986
Posted 12/16/2015 06:32 (#4963478 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


South Dakota
Thanks guys, just trying to get a perspective of what other people thoughts are. I appreciate it
Top of the page Bottom of the page
mn2
Posted 12/16/2015 07:15 (#4963553 - in reply to #4963478)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


2 quarters around me that bids were due yesterday. One piece decent but could get wet, no tile, other one very light. Bto was farming it, actually took over a lease 2 years ago from a bigger bto who gave it up after 1 year. Talked to absentee land owner yesterday said had a bid in low 3's, I'm assuming he meant low 300's.

Edited by mn2 12/16/2015 07:44
Top of the page Bottom of the page
ohio474
Posted 12/16/2015 08:29 (#4963686 - in reply to #4963553)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


north east ohio in the snow belt Ashtabula co
1800 acres x 240 / acre == 432,000 / year !!!! WOW
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Farms With CASE
Posted 12/16/2015 09:25 (#4963829 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: $160-170



North Liberty and South Bend, Indiana
$160-170. That's what I'd pay assuming it typically averaged that and not hit it on a great year.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
GrainTrader
Posted 12/16/2015 11:31 (#4964042 - in reply to #4963829)
Subject: RE: $160-170



20 Miles West of Indianapolis Indiana
+1

Add in a voluntary bonus. Nothing big, but enough of a "profit sharing" type deal to make em feel like you care.

Edited by GrainTrader 12/16/2015 11:31
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Farms With CASE
Posted 12/16/2015 16:19 (#4964597 - in reply to #4964042)
Subject: RE: $160-170



North Liberty and South Bend, Indiana
Exactly.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
roush9799
Posted 12/16/2015 11:49 (#4964085 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent



West Central IL
$200-$220, if you are lucky and know them very well. Half of a farm that we farmed sold. We were giving $212 for the whole works. We ended up renting the half back that he kept, actually got him down to $200 and signed it for 3 years. Offered the guy that bought the other half $212 and he said he could get at least $275 for it. It is ground just as you described.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jon Gruden
Posted 12/16/2015 12:40 (#4964198 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Chapel Hill NC
A $ a bushel seems for than fair but I doubt they go for it
Top of the page Bottom of the page
FarmBoySmoke
Posted 12/18/2015 21:47 (#4970708 - in reply to #4962521)
Subject: RE: 160-170 bushel corn ground cash rent


Tipp Co IN
.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jump to forum :
Search this forum
Printer friendly version
E-mail a link to this thread

(Delete cookies)